Kawasaki Versys Forum banner

61 - 80 of 96 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
33 Posts
2015 Versys 650 Accessory 5 amp fuse too small

I bought the accessory relay: relay Item# 99994-0556 for about $17 and installed which was pretty easy. Next I installed an aftermarket shift indicator (turns out the after market version needs to plug in under the seat into ecu module) but $40 vs a lot more it was worth it and it works great. Next I installed a dual USB port, then the Oxford Heated Grips and finally 2 sets of LED lights with 6 bulbs each: 1 set 30 degree spots and 1 set 60 degree floods. Both are 18W 1800 lumens. Blew the 5 amp fuse on a test ride last night with heated grips and LED lights + USB port all on that one 5 amp fuse. Seems ridiculous that there is a 30 amp Relay 4 pre-wired accessory leads all back to one 5 Amp fuse. 4 LED lights each draw 1.5 amps = 6 amps, Heated Grips about 3.6 for the pair and USB port is about 2.0 amps so total is: 11.6 amps. I used some trailer conduit to hide the wiring from the base of each of the LED lights until I could get the wires hidden under the cowling - worked out great when finished.

Any suggestions on what I should do? Just splice the LED lights into the lighting wiring or horn or brake lights or turn signals or is it possible that the wiring for these accessories could handle a larger fuse? Thanks for any help.

PS: I tried to include pics with this post but I don't have enough posts yet.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,182 Posts
You have placed a LOT on that OEM auxiliary relay. IMHO it's too much.

It might be overkill, but on my Versys I only use these OEM auxiliary relays to power other relays which I have used to power extra components (i.e.: one relay for air horn, 1 relay for auxiliary lights, etc.). Each of these relays, which are fused and directly connected to 12 volts, are activated by the OEM auxiliary relay. = no blown fuses.

Good luck!
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
33 Posts
Thanks. Can you explain how you wire these other relays off the OEM aux. Relay to power other accessories? Everything work fine until I added the LED lights, that's why I was thinking if I just wired the LED lights into the existing head light wiring which has a 15 amp fuse I should be go to go.
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
9,060 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,182 Posts
Thanks. Can you explain how you wire these other relays off the OEM aux. Relay to power other accessories? Everything work fine until I added the LED lights, that's why I was thinking if I just wired the LED lights into the existing head light wiring which has a 15 amp fuse I should be go to go.
I'm on my way out the door and therefore do not have time to draw up a diagram. However the following should give you a good idea of what I'm using.
Note: In my first response, I had not mentioned that I use an auxiliary fuse panel for the "extra" items such as auxiliary lights, etc.



In the above diagram, replace the "to sidelight" by your OEM auxiliary relay (pin 86). Pin 30 would be connected to a fuse block or individual fuse. Thus you could add more extra relays that are powered by your OEM auxiliary relay without any problems.

Good luck!
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
163 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
33 Posts
Thanks. Adding another relay seems like the prudent path to do this correctly and not risk more blown fuses or worse. I already have on/off switches wired into each set of two LED lights so I really just need to wire into another relay.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
33 Posts
Thanks...but this leaves me with more questions. One relay powering another relay? Doesn't each relay power itself? While I have the Service Manual / all the wiring diagrams I'm sure where I should be accessing the wires on the bike referenced in your diagram. That said I do appreciate your help - thank you very much!
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
33 Posts
I saw other posts where it seems that switching out to a 10A fuse should be fine but I'd hate to find out the hard way that it could not handle a 15A fuse - Thanks!
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
33 Posts
I'm new to this forum and don't know how to navigate that well. I'm trying to add my related issue to this post - sorry if I not doing this correctly.
I bought the accessory relay: relay Item# 99994-0556 for about $17 and installed which was pretty easy. Next I installed an aftermarket shift indicator (turns out the after market version needs to plug in under the seat into ecu module) but $40 vs a lot more it was worth it and it works great. Next I installed a dual USB port, then the Oxford Heated Grips and finally 2 sets of LED lights with 6 bulbs each: 1 set 30 degree spots and 1 set 60 degree floods. Both are 18W 1800 lumens. Blew the 5 amp fuse on a test ride last night with heated grips and LED lights + USB port all on that one 5 amp fuse. Seems ridiculous that there is a 30 amp Relay 4 pre-wired accessory leads all back to one 5 Amp fuse. 4 LED lights each draw 1.5 amps = 6 amps, Heated Grips about 3.6 for the pair and USB port is about 2.0 amps so total is: 11.6 amps. I used some trailer conduit to hide the wiring from the base of each of the LED lights until I could get the wires hidden under the cowling - worked out great when finished.

Any suggestions on what I should do?

Try keeping all your questions on the same subject in the same thread, each time a reply is made, all the previous posters get notification on new posts made, if they have that set in user preference. By starting a new thread, previous posters are unaware of comments and become discouraged having to repeat themselves. Thank You**** Edited by Onewizard
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
163 Posts
Thanks...but this leaves me with more questions. One relay powering another relay? Doesn't each relay power itself? While I have the Service Manual / all the wiring diagrams I'm sure where I should be accessing the wires on the bike referenced in your diagram. That said I do appreciate your help - thank you very much!
You are using the 12V output of one relay to drive the coil of another relay. The relay coil requires very little power. Then you wire your LEDs to the output of the added relay. The added relay will require a 12V input which is fused. You can run a wire with a fuse holder directly to your battery.

You really do not have add another relay unless you want the lights to be switched with the ignition switch. If you don't mind them staying on when you shut off your bike, then just wire the switch directly to the battery (through a fuse holder of course). The LEDs draw a small enough power, that your switch and wiring should be able to handle it without a relay.
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
9,060 Posts
Poor Design

. LED lights with 6 bulbs each: Both are 18W 1800 lumens.
FYI LED lights 18 watt/ 14.2 VDC=1.26 ADC X 4= 5.04 amp DC total, as the voltage drops the current will go up, there is a driver inside these that will compensate for a voltage range, typically above 15 to 16 VDC failure occurs or as is said the magic smoke escapes 72 to 80 Watts


Blew the 5 amp fuse on a test ride last night with heated grips and LED lights + USB port all on that one 5 amp fuse. Seems ridiculous that there is a 30 amp Relay 4 pre-wired accessory leads all back to one 5 Amp fuse.[/QUOTE said:
Yes the relay has a looks like 18 gauge wire , it branches off from the relay to a branch connector with 4 taps off it, so three choices;
#1 increase to a 10 amp fuse maximum,
#2 run a separate 14 gauge fused wire from the battery to the positive terminal of the relay, maximum fuse size then 15 amp.
#3 run a 12 or 10 gauge wire to a fuse block , install a relay ahead of it, use the $17 relay wiring to control the relay and leave the USB outlet on the $17 relay circuit. The lights and heated grips come off the fuse block each with their individual fuse.Which is how I wired my bike, if you were to scroll up on this thread, In Canada I can buy a 30/40 amp relay cw/ harness at Princess auto for about $12( Harbor Freight in US)
#4 split off your fog light and tie into the city light circuit, convert city lights to Philips Vision LED, that circuit is fused at 10 amp
#5 a combination of all of the above
#6 just put in a 15 amp fuse and hope you don't melt the wiring or start a fire, 15 amp X 14.2=213 watts, or 2/3 of the stator output
#7 get a small Honda generator>:)
Heated Grips about 3.6 for the pair[/quote said:
3.6 X 14.2 VDC= 52 Watts This is correct, maximum could reach 4 amp total according to Oxford


and USB port is about 2.0 amps [/QUOTE said:
about 0.8 amp maximum @ 14.2 VDC

Any suggestions [/quote said:
I don't understand what you are doing with the LED lights, their total power is greater than one headlight, I can tell you, you might want to think about getting some sort of voltage indicator, which is in another thread, what you are trying to run here comes close to exceeding the output of your stator of 330 Watts. Expect to be discharging your battery when close to idle. To run what you have, you need to convert your headlight to Cree LED, also city lights to LED .

If possible start at the beginning of this thread, it was made a sticky to help people like yourself.
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
9,060 Posts
Power Outlet Install Thread

Try keeping all your questions on the same subject in the same thread, each time a reply is made, all the previous posters get notification on new posts made, if they have that set in user preference. By starting a new thread, previous posters are unaware of comments and become discouraged having to repeat themselves, provided they even bother. Thank You**** Edited by Onewizard
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
966 Posts
After pricing all the stuff that Kawasaki requires to install their OEM 12v power source I decided to just make my own.

I used a standard marine type 12v power source plug in ($9.95), a curly two wire to run back to the battery (I had one laying around), and an inline blade fuse holder ($1.99 + fuse which I had). It's mounted in the OEM hole which required a bit of "fitting".

It is hooked directly to the battery (I didn't want a switched source) and routed under the fairings to the Battery Tender plug in under the seat. I don't plan on leaving anything plugged in when I'm off the bike (some folks can't be trusted not to walk off with devices).

Cash outlay was a tad over $12.00 and some shop supplies (shrink tubing, solder, etc.). Took me about two hours to assemble and route everything. Perfect placement to plug in my iPhone while riding.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
33 Posts
Great info explaining this. I have a much better understanding on how to do this on my bike now - thanks! Only question I have is why isn't a fuse needed between the lights and the relay 87?
Thanks for all the help!
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
9,060 Posts
Branch Circuit Wiring

Great info explaining this. I have a much better understanding on how to do this on my bike now - thanks! Only question I have is why isn't a fuse needed between the lights and the relay 87?
Thanks for all the help!
Normally what should be done is the relay gets fused at equal to the wire size feeding , 12 gauge =20 amp, 10 gauge =30 amp. Next all the loads off the relay 87 should be individually fuse. Say you crash your bike and one of the fog lights shorts out, if fused individually the heated grips and all other loads continue to work. Split the fog lights and spots with individual fuses, same crash leaves the spot lights and all others working.
Personally I fuse all individual circuits that have been added, except loads at or below 2 amp, GPS and USB on the aux. wiring fuse circuit.
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
9,060 Posts
Branch Circuit Wiring 101 / Voltage Drop

I thought I would do a post under this thread, as it comes up from time to time. I am sure only a few will understand what I have here.
Because I took the time to post else where I thought it only right to post here with some additions.

Power Distribution 101

Voltage drop

I will use a example of something most on this forum have experienced, say a portable heater or a skill saw plugged into a extension cord, you notice the plug is starting to melt and the cord is warm or hot. That is voltage drop/ losses in the form of heat, lets say you bought 1000 units of power for the work done,say it was a portable heater, say your heater had a display on it showing units of power used. You notice it shows 900 units, you bought 1000 units, what gives, 100 units of power were wasted heating the cord up, that pretty much sums it up. So what if you used a proper 12 gauge cord for that portable heater, what you would have found is you used 900 units but only bought 910 units, so 10 units were wasted using a 12 gauge cord.


This really applies to automotive wiring
Why is that? Utilities use very high voltage to transfer power over long distances, then use transformers at the point of use. We can compare electricity to water. A high pressure washer uses a small reinforced hose and can move a fair amount of water, in the house standard years ago was a half inch water line, nowadays it is 3/4 or 1 inch, why because someone flushes the toilet and the shower stops upstairs for those with the old half inch line. Water flow and current are one and the same, you want more water , increase the size of the line or increase the pressure. Electricity, the lower the voltage, the greater the wire gauge needs to be to supply the same amount of energy. If you look at audio electronics, guys with 100 watt or greater speakers are running 4 gauge wire, yet in cars and bikes the same 100 watts we use 16 or 18 gauge wire. How do we get away with it? It is over short distances, usually less than 4 feet, are there losses, yes, the biggest loss you will see is if you install a 10 or 15 amp fuse in the Aux. fuse holder on the 650ABS MK-3. However you would need to run a heated jacket, heated grips and 4 led lights off that circuit. Run it around 0'F or plus 3'F for about 3 hours.
Please post if you notice a odor similar to plastic melting while your waiting for the traffic light to change . >:)


Voltage drop 101

Voltage drop is the energy lost in the wire used to transfer the energy from the source to the load. Nowadays many manufacturers are reducing the copper used in switch gear , fuse blocks etc. the end result is in the case of fuses, the wire connected to the fuse block serves two purposes, #1 to transfer electrical energy, #2 to transfer heat , so if the wire size is undersized, the heat generated from current flowing through the fuse, may build up over time and cause the fuse to open, this is what I call a nuisance fail, as the current through a 10 amp fuse may be 80% / 8 amp, and the fuse will open.

To do a simple explanation, not going into actual ohms per foot / wire gauge. Say you have a 10 amp load, your voltage supplying the load is 14.2 volts DC, you put a meter on at your load and discover you have 13.2 volts, that seems acceptable, wait a second , you have a loss of 1 volt at 10 amp .Watts is volts X amps, 1X10 = 10 watts lost in the wire in the form of heat. So if you increase the wire size, you may have 14.1 volts at the load or .1 volt loss = 10 X .1 = 1 Watt .

So why did I explain this and what does it have to do with the MK-3 auxiliary circuit?

Increasing the fuse size from 5 to 10 amp, on a undersized wire will work ,however expect much higher losses, put in a 15 amp fuse and run at 80% or greater expect a loss of 10 watts or greater, is there enough energy produced to melt the wire, possibly over several hours of riding, it could melt, the next problem is if it does it may short out other circuits, at some point you may need a new wiring harness!! Is it worth the risk , rather than installing a proper distribution with correct wire sizes and fusing??

[ 80% is a factor used in wiring , considering current rating of wiring tables apply a load of 80%. That is our 15 amp breaker at home is rated at 15X120 VAC=1800 watts X 80%= 1440 Watts. Many hair dryers and other devices became larger in wattage, hence the reason why 20 amp T slot receptacles came about, wired with 12 gauge wire and on a 20 amp breaker, so you can plug in your 1800 Watt hair dryer that has cUL approval ( UL testing labs approved for use in c , c stands for Canada) that has a 15 amp plug on it into the 20 amp circuit , 20X120VAC= 2400 Watts X 80%= 1920 Watts.]


One last thing, the stator outputs 330 watts totall, I prefer all the watts doing proper work, any heat produced I want in my grips or Gerbing jacket, not in the wiring.

In the MK-3 2015 650ABS they went from the optional accessory relay to a tap block and from there they have four spots with bullet connectors & options for fog lights etc., unfortunately they cheapened up on the wire size from the fuse block to the relay and from the relay to the tap connector.




The short form of this post is BELOW:thumb::thumb: POST #90 :yeahsmile:
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
163 Posts
One last thing, the stator outputs 330 watts totall, I prefer all the watts doing proper work, any heat produced I want in my grips or Gerbing jacket, not in the wiring.

In the MK-3 2015 650ABS they went from the optional accessory relay to a tap block and from there they have four spots with bullet connectors & options for fog lights etc., unfortunately they cheapened up on the wire size from the fuse block to the relay and from the relay to the tap connector.
Kawasaki designed the electrical system for the Versys 650 with very little reserve capacity for accessories. There is a notice on page 75 of the owners manual that says:

"The vehicle has electrical accessory circuit (5A fuse) for the socket and connectors. Always install a fuse 5A or less for the circuit. Do not connect more than 40W of total load to the vehicle's electrical system or the battery may become discharge, even with the engine running".

It is pretty clear that many people are drastically overloading their electrical system. (according to Kawasaki). If you put 5A though the circuit, you are overloading the circuit by 20W. At 12V, we are talking about 3.3A max (to keep it less than 40W).

I am running the Kawasaki gear indicator, an accessory socket, Oxford heated grips, and the Kawasaki driving lights. I have not blown a fuse yet, but there is not much margin. Fortunately, I have my Denali air horn on a separate circuit.
 
61 - 80 of 96 Posts
Top