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I have heard of a lot of people adding a lot of things to their diesel fuel for a lot of different reasons. One of the most common reasons I hear is that the sulphur has been removed from the diesel, and therefore the fuel itself is a lot less "lubricitous." And therefore, causing trouble with fuel systems that apparently counted on the sulphur in the fuel as a lubricant for proper operation.

That's an interesting belief, and it has it's roots in some older oil additive chemistry that relied on a very few, very specific types of sulphur compounds for some lubrication. Actually still used in some specialty applications. In oil - not fuel. Because prior to the requirement for refineries to produce ultra-low sulphur diesel, the sulphur that used to be in the fuel was never of the 'lubricitous' type, and never contributed in any meaningful or measurable way to lubrication of the engine's fuel system. In the meantime, modern diesel engine producers were well aware of the requirement for ULSD loooooong before it actually arrived, and if their injection systems needed to be re-designed in order to deal with ULSD and the higher performance and lower pollution specs afforded by modern engine management syetems that can take advantage of ULSD , they had plenty of time to do it. In the leadup to the rollout of ULSD and the followup after it's widespread adoption, I saw no engine manufacturers coming back on major refiners with claims of harm to their engines or systems. It is not in a producer's best interests to sell a product that harms the consumers equipment.
 

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My friend who I grew up with has been a motorcycle fanatic all his life. Raced motorcycles all his life, owned 2 dealerships, and now has his own high performance racing shop. When I told him of this practice he had never heard of it. That being said, after he had thought on it a while came back with. "If it does not hurt the performance or significantly alter the running of the engine, he could see nothing but good from it". His speculation, and it is speculation, is that enviromental friendly fuel has been stripped of so many lubricants that a little bit of lube in the top end (If I am not mistaken) could only be beneficial.
Now for my own results. I have been running the wally world oil that has been listed here 1 oz. per 5 gallon for the last 2 or 3 fill ups. I have noticed that I get an occasional light pop before the engine is completely warmed up (I never got this before). But once the engine has come up to operating temp. it seems to run and idle a little smoother. I am speculating the operating temp. is important to get complete combustion of this fuel mix. Maybe not, but just my observations.
 

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Lead - the actual additive, tetra-ethyl lead - was used primarily as an octane enhancer. It did have some lubrication properties, and engine manufacturers made use of that property in the design of their systems.

Lead made it possible for refiners to manufacture gasoline of lower "quality' - at the bottom of the specs for gasoline - more heavy components in the fuel, etc - this makes it less expensive to make - then - throw in a bit of lead to bring up the octane, and out the door it goes. To a person not familiar with fuels - somehow, leaving out the 'heavies' meant the gas had less lubrication properties for the top end of an engine. It simply isn't the case. It was never there as a lubricant in the first place, and the compounds never had any significant lubricant qualities anyway.

Without lead, refiners are forced to make a more technical, what outsiders call "purer" product - in order to meet the octane and distillation spec.

There are a few octane-enhancing additives available to a refiner. None are as effective as lead was, and none have the lubricative properties lead bestowed on the fuel. But engine manufacturers and designers no longer need it - design has eliminated the requirement.

Your friend isn't wrong. Racing oils (and what racers do with them) are a different thing altogether than common oil used in everyday vehicles. Apart from being a non-contributor to the power event in your engine - the oil is taking up space from actual fuel - a bit of oil in your gas shouldn't hurt anything. But it shouldn't be required... What isn't being taken into account here is the additive packages in the oil. Oil isn't just oil - it's an exotic mix of additives, some not designed to do something in an off-brand application.
 

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EFS Combust. I was given a copy of a magazine, Grassroots Motorsports in a swag bag at the Octane Academy. In it was a article about this stuff. If was tested in a rental car (Ford Focus) on a dyno and produced about a 5 hp gain. I haven't tried it or even seen it but I am a little curious.
 

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Lead - the actual additive, tetra-ethyl lead - was used primarily as an octane enhancer. It did have some lubrication properties, and engine manufacturers made use of that property in the design of their systems.

Lead made it possible for refiners to manufacture gasoline of lower "quality' - at the bottom of the specs for gasoline - more heavy components in the fuel, etc - this makes it less expensive to make - then - throw in a bit of lead to bring up the octane, and out the door it goes. To a person not familiar with fuels - somehow, leaving out the 'heavies' meant the gas had less lubrication properties for the top end of an engine. It simply isn't the case. It was never there as a lubricant in the first place, and the compounds never had any significant lubricant qualities anyway.

Without lead, refiners are forced to make a more technical, what outsiders call "purer" product - in order to meet the octane and distillation spec.

There are a few octane-enhancing additives available to a refiner. None are as effective as lead was, and none have the lubricative properties lead bestowed on the fuel. But engine manufacturers and designers no longer need it - design has eliminated the requirement.

Your friend isn't wrong. Racing oils (and what racers do with them) are a different thing altogether than common oil used in everyday vehicles. Apart from being a non-contributor to the power event in your engine - the oil is taking up space from actual fuel - a bit of oil in your gas shouldn't hurt anything. But it shouldn't be required... What isn't being taken into account here is the additive packages in the oil. Oil isn't just oil - it's an exotic mix of additives, some not designed to do something in an off-brand application.
Yea. That is why I wanted to stress that what he was saying was all speculative. Just something to think about, since had not heard of it, he was defintely not claiming to be an authority on it.
 

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I haven't notice an mpg increase, however the engine is much smoother. It felt as if I was on a new bike. I like, I will continue to use and recommend. Lucas at O'riley's buy two get one free.
 

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EFS Combust. I was given a copy of a magazine, Grassroots Motorsports in a swag bag at the Octane Academy. In it was a article about this stuff. If was tested in a rental car (Ford Focus) on a dyno and produced about a 5 hp gain. I haven't tried it or even seen it but I am a little curious.

Oil of Snake, but please, don't take my word for it. It's only $20 for 5 ounces.

"EFS COMBUST reformulates the hydrocarbon fuel on a molecular level." Sure it does! :D Amateurs, too. Website verrrrrry carefully written to avoid legal problems. They RACE the stuff? Spec cars with additives in their fuel? Hmmmm... couldn't even get a away with that in the Honda 5.5 HP cart series! I guess if it's just club racing, anything goes.

I once saw a tech at the research centre who was dyno/flow/exhaust gas etc. testing a fuel in some kind of BMW. During a steady-state part of the test at 5252 rpm, He repositioned a fan in the tunnel blowing air at the front of the car - and the HP/torque trace jumped up, I forget how much. Magic, apparently, no snakes required. Just a tiny change in cooling.

Dyno testing can be tricky... I know very little about it.
 

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I just ordered a pint of this:
Uplon Fuel Lube



I know a few guys who run this in the alcohol drag bikes. Swear by it as well.
One of them runs it in his Harley as well, says is makes a huge difference in vibrations.

After running the TC-W3 for a while, I noticed I started to lack some performance, almost a mini lag in throttle input to power delivery, even at 1oz-1.5oz per gallon. It was baby smooth though!

I'll report back after a few tank fulls of this "fuel lube"
 

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"Fuel Lube"? Really!

I love this claim - "dry and abrasive properties of methanol alcohol."

Dry! Abrasive! So - what does it do - make it wet and slippery? Sounds like oil to me. I would be very surprised indeed if it could actually lessen any significant amount of friction in any of the spinny parts it actually comes into contact with, especially enough to make a measurable increase in horsepower. But hey, who knows, they may have come up with something totally unique and effective. Like a lottery system. Even though everybody knows they don't work, but if enough people buy them, someone is bound to win - and then, it's Look! Proof!

You know why lube oil manufacturers don't spend much time testing or analyzing, let alone debunking these products? The vast vast vast majority of them are just variations of known products - with different labels and marketing. Chemistry, physics, and experience tells us they don't work. Unless making your wallet lighter and thinner adds performance to your ride.
 

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"Fuel Lube"? Really!

I love this claim - "dry and abrasive properties of methanol alcohol."

Dry! Abrasive! So - what does it do - make it wet and slippery? Sounds like oil to me. I would be very surprised indeed if it could actually lessen any significant amount of friction in any of the spinny parts it actually comes into contact with, especially enough to make a measurable increase in horsepower. But hey, who knows, they may have come up with something totally unique and effective. Like a lottery system. Even though everybody knows they don't work, but if enough people buy them, someone is bound to win - and then, it's Look! Proof!

You know why lube oil manufacturers don't spend much time testing or analyzing, let alone debunking these products? The vast vast vast majority of them are just variations of known products - with different labels and marketing. Chemistry, physics, and experience tells us they don't work. Unless making your wallet lighter and thinner adds performance to your ride.
I am not looking for HP gains.

But on TC-W3 my mileage did go up, and the bike ran noticeably smoother. On both my bikes, and my 1986 F-150.

Tell me it didn't work! :eek:
 

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It wouldn't be possible for me or anyone else to tell anyone it didn't work, given a single data point. One would have to compare two or more side by side, under the exact same conditions - which is generally impossible in the real world. You would personally have to have two identical bikes - and ride them both at the same time.
All I can say is, after years of testing, years of searching out additives to put in fuels and oils, trying out new manufacturing processes, different crudes, etc. - anything to give Brand X any tiny edge in mileage, performance, or service life, over Brand Y - under lab test conditions with proper controls for variability in place - none of this stuff actually does anything that a properly tuned, properly functioning engine should need doing. If it does do something for your setup, look further - there may be something fundamentally wrong somewhere.
 

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That's a very cool ad, back when companies were still able to make 'questionable' claims about their fuels. Hmm, knowing what we know about 'drafting' as it is used in NASCAR, could this have has an effect on the trailing car's mileage, to the tune of a few percent?
"Platformate" is nothing more than a common gasoline blend component that is made on a production unit called a "platformer" - it's a big fixed-bed platinum catalyst reactor that (very basically) strips off some hydrogen from some low-octane straight-run naphthas (distilled straight out of crude oil) and makes them higher octane, and these products have a better response to lead, back in the day. Tech has been around since just after WW2, common today, most refineries have some sort of platformer, they have various names, depending on whose technology you license.

Are you old enough to remember Gulf No-Nox? Very successful campaign. Made all sorts of claims about increased octane, more power, etc. because they used this miracle additive. No-Nox was just tetra-ethyl lead - everybody had it in their gasoline, it just took Gulf's marketing genius to change the name to something catchy and present it as something only they had, and they moved a ton of customers to Gulf products.

These Shell ads touting "V-Power" and "Nitrogen Enriched" gasoline give me a bit of a chuckle, lately... :D
 

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Include me among the dubious about this. I get 50 mpg and that seems great to me. Marvel Mystery Oil, which is probably just glorified kerosene for all I know, was a fine upper-engine lube, I was told, and I used on my XS650 air-cooled motor. Did it work? I have no idea. But it smelled nice. As for Versys engine smoothness, the faster it turns the smoother the motor becomes. I have never found the vibration objectionable anyway, except perhaps in the right footpeg. You have to wonder what Kawasaki's engineers think about all this.
 

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Lead - the actual additive, tetra-ethyl lead - was used primarily as an octane enhancer. It did have some lubrication properties, and engine manufacturers made use of that property in the design of their systems.

Lead made it possible for refiners to manufacture gasoline of lower "quality' - at the bottom of the specs for gasoline - more heavy components in the fuel, etc - this makes it less expensive to make - then - throw in a bit of lead to bring up the octane, and out the door it goes. To a person not familiar with fuels - somehow, leaving out the 'heavies' meant the gas had less lubrication properties for the top end of an engine. It simply isn't the case. It was never there as a lubricant in the first place, and the compounds never had any significant lubricant qualities anyway.

Without lead, refiners are forced to make a more technical, what outsiders call "purer" product - in order to meet the octane and distillation spec.

There are a few octane-enhancing additives available to a refiner. None are as effective as lead was, and none have the lubricative properties lead bestowed on the fuel. But engine manufacturers and designers no longer need it - design has eliminated the requirement.

Your friend isn't wrong. Racing oils (and what racers do with them) are a different thing altogether than common oil used in everyday vehicles. Apart from being a non-contributor to the power event in your engine - the oil is taking up space from actual fuel - a bit of oil in your gas shouldn't hurt anything. But it shouldn't be required... What isn't being taken into account here is the additive packages in the oil. Oil isn't just oil - it's an exotic mix of additives, some not designed to do something in an off-brand application.
I apprceciate your expertise in this field.
My question is what do you do with the tons of ancedotal positive experiences. Are all suffering from mass suggestive delusion.
I am not talking about huge MPG/ or HP increase. But if someone is saying their bike seems to run a little smoother. I gotta say, I would probably believe them.
I am a Med Tech. and while I know nothing of your field, I do know my instruments, just because of years of familiarity. I can tell just by the sound or feel of one of my instruments if it is not running at optimum ability, something that just anyone would not know. So, if a guy who has been riding his bike for the last couple of years and has logged thousands of miles on it, tells me that it is less "Viby" and the idle is smoother, he probably knows what he is talking about????
 

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I apprceciate your expertise in this field.
My question is what do you do with the tons of ancedotal positive experiences. Are all suffering from mass suggestive delusion.
I am not talking about huge MPG/ or HP increase. But if someone is saying their bike seems to run a little smoother. I gotta say, I would probably believe them.
I am a Med Tech. and while I know nothing of your field, I do know my instruments, just because of years of familiarity. I can tell just by the sound or feel of one of my instruments if it is not running at optimum ability, something that just anyone would not know. So, if a guy who has been riding his bike for the last couple of years and has logged thousands of miles on it, tells me that it is less "Viby" and the idle is smoother, he probably knows what he is talking about????
This thread really an "oil thread". It just keeps going and going... :goodluck:
 
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