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What are your thoughts on using MMO (marvel mystery oil)?
I worked in a metric bike shop in the early 80's. It was 20 miles to the nearest town.

Every now and then, a brand new bike would just "lock up" before it got to town. The story was that the tolerances were so close that some uneven heating would occur.

Some salesman showed up one day and was peddling Marvel Mystery Oil. Short story is that we started putting two ounces in every tankful on a brand new bike - and we never had another one "lock up"

About a year later, we substituted an couple ounces of 2-cycle oil, with the same results.

:thumb:
 

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I worked in a metric bike shop in the early 80's. It was 20 miles to the nearest town.

Every now and then, a brand new bike would just "lock up" before it got to town. The story was that the tolerances were so close that some uneven heating would occur.

Some salesman showed up one day and was peddling Marvel Mystery Oil. Short story is that we started putting two ounces in every tankful on a brand new bike - and we never had another one "lock up"

About a year later, we substituted an couple ounces of 2-cycle oil, with the same results.

:thumb:
Interesting... Just as 2-cycle engines require more oil mixed with gasoline for initial break-in's inherent increased friction and heat.
 

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My baby gets a few shots of Knob Creek Single barrel on special occasions and responds sobilly,, :yeahsmile:
 

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Valvoline make an excellent 2 stroke outboard oil. Its blue in colour. In New Zealand it was recognized as a premium outboard oil. Yamaha outboards sold it under their Yamaha brand name.
 

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I added three drop of Marvel Mystery Oil to my tank and now my Versys will power wheelie in third gear! Gawd!
Wait till you try IT w/ two olives and a 'touch' of Vermouth...!

:stickpoke:
 

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Shell Nautilus TC-W3 / JASO FB-FC

I bought the Shell Nautilus TC-W3 , JASO FB FC-exhaust to try.
Did a lot of reading on the subject and was leaning towards the wally mart supertech tc-3w, but quite a few users commented on smell/stink.

so, what the heck, lets try something else.

half the price of quicksilver or lucas, what can go wrong?

I opted for non-synthetic oil version, from what i gathered the synth version is using ester basestock and the problem with ester synthetic basestocks (which for example Amsoil, Klotz, and Redline use), is that they are hygroscopic (meaning they absorb water).
If you are using Ethanol mix gasoline that is hygroscopic by nature + this additive = corrosion.

First seat-o-pants impression:

- smoother idle, quicker warmup in this $hitty cold weather
- less vibration, it now sounds like true sewing machine, LOL
- no odor to speak of, maybe a slight hint of ammonia from the ashless additives, but it might be placebo effect
- one thing i noticed for sure is smoother operation in lower rpm range (3000-4000rpm), when i want to crank the throttle it does not need that much "higher manifold pressure / no rpm change" associated grunt sound to get going, it just goes
- i have no data on MPG, i do not record my data


so whachdoyathink?
 

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I think that being hygroscopic is not always a bad thing. It's not like it would soak up large amounts of moisture.

... and (assuming) that they are "hygroscopic" means that there's no water just sitting in there anywhere.

I would also say that short trips, especially in cool to cold weather create more moisture in a crankcase than any oil, additive, or gasoline blend. Even worse is those misguided few that find it necessary to start their bikes on a regular basis during winter storage "just to keep it lubed".

We've run ethanol-laced fuel in these parts for more than 30 years. I have yet to have a corrosion or fuel related problem.
 

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I think that being hygroscopic is not always a bad thing. It's not like it would soak up large amounts of moisture.

... and (assuming) that they are "hygroscopic" means that there's no water just sitting in there anywhere.
...
There are a few commercial fuel additives that help remove water from the tank and labeled as such, these would be called "hygroscopic" in nature.
It basically pulls apart the water molecule bonds so they then fit between the fuel molecules so that you can still pass them through filters, and injectors.
Straight water cannot run a car, and can stall and damage fuel pumps etc, but when 'hygroscopic', it is fine. It is not like you are running a 50/50 mixture... we are talking about few drops of water per tank. Any water burnt in the combustion process will only act as a steam clean (like water/Injection but not enough to see the benefits of it)

I run a quality ashless 2-Stoke quite regularly in my 96 VW Golf TDI, 2011 VW Jetta CR TDI @200:1, and now in my Versys @600:1.
 

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Marvel Mystery Oil in my V, 1 to 2oz per 5Gal. Runs strong and flawlessly.
 

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I bought the Shell Nautilus TC-W3 , JASO FB FC-exhaust to try.
Did a lot of reading on the subject and was leaning towards the wally mart supertech tc-3w, but quite a few users commented on smell/stink.

so, what the heck, lets try something else.

half the price of quicksilver or lucas, what can go wrong?

I opted for non-synthetic oil version, from what i gathered the synth version is using ester basestock and the problem with ester synthetic basestocks (which for example Amsoil, Klotz, and Redline use), is that they are hygroscopic (meaning they absorb water).
If you are using Ethanol mix gasoline that is hygroscopic by nature + this additive = corrosion.

First seat-o-pants impression:

- smoother idle, quicker warmup in this $hitty cold weather
- less vibration, it now sounds like true sewing machine, LOL
- no odor to speak of, maybe a slight hint of ammonia from the ashless additives, but it might be placebo effect
- one thing i noticed for sure is smoother operation in lower rpm range (3000-4000rpm), when i want to crank the throttle it does not need that much "higher manifold pressure / no rpm change" associated grunt sound to get going, it just goes
- i have no data on MPG, i do not record my data


so whachdoyathink?
I have been using the Wally world supertech tc-3w 1 Tbl. spoon per 2.5 gallons

I concur with your findings, in my bike as well. Seems to definitely run smoother at all ranges. Have not really noticed any smell.
 

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I can give you my experience regarding oils, fuels, and additives, but it's up to you to make up your own mind in an informed way.

The company (actually, companies) I was associated with for many years manufactured *most* of the ingredients that are used in all additive packages for all fuels and oils used in North America - and most of the world. Although not the only company that manufactures and researches new fuels and additives, if you were in the additive biz and aren't a major fuel producer, you most likely purchased your additives - if not the entire custom mix - from us.

Here's the truth - there are 3 kinds of after-market additive that can be sold and added to your fuel in North America.

1. The most common - a small bottle of additives with a custom manufacturer's name on it that you can safely add to your fuel every time you gas up.

This type of product typically contains a hydrocarbon solvent - most often a low-flash point naphtha - into which the actual additives are dissolved. The additives in a product like this are the exact same additives that are already in the gasoline in your tank. You are just adding a tiny bit more of the same thing. The reason it is this way -there are only some additives allowed in our fuels by law. Everything the fuel company adds to the gas at the tank before it is shipped out is tested and certified to do what it says it does, and to be harmless to the catalytic converter and other engine systems, and is of a low enough toxicity that it can safely be sold to a consumer. So - a custom additive seller has the same restrictions... and they can't add anything exotic, in case there are unwanted chemical reactions with the additives already present in the fuel. So - do they work? A qualified YES - they work as well as the additives already in the gas, and if you're using fresh, quality gas from a name-brand manufacturer, you should not need extra additives.

2. The second most common - a small bottle of additives with a custom manufacturer's name on it that you can safely add to your fuel every now and then, that is advertised to perform a specific function.

Same as the additive package above - this type of product typically contains a hydrocarbon solvent - most often a low-flash point naphtha - into which the actual additives are dissolved. The difference is that there are some pretty specific duties that can be accomplished with something like a carb or fuel system cleaner package, or isopropyl alcohol used as a water scavenger - that can't be done with just a regular fuel additive. These types of packages are meant to be used every now and then, and should not remain in the tank very long. Do they work? Sure. And in most cases, the cheap house-brand ones work just as well as the expensive ones - because for the most part, they contain the exact same chemicals, for the same reasons noted above.

3. Third most common - Snake Oil. Stuff that makes grandiose claims that violate the laws of physics, promise increases in engine power or mileage that can't be substantiated, increased service life, etc.

This type of additive is often sold quite legally, for a while, at least... because like 1. and 2. above, it can't contain anything not already allowed and specified for the same reasons. It's the claims that are bogus. Often, they contain no additives at all, just a (functionally) useless hydrocarbon or alcohol solvent, that does nothing but occupy space in your tank that could otherwise be taken up by good, fresh, gas. So - buyer beware.

There is a fourth type - and that is off-brand use of a non-specified product. An example of this is using outboard engine oil mixed with gasoline - but there are plenty of others.
In this case, one is using a product for a purpose it is not designed for. It's possible that the additive packages are incompatible, there could be unwanted chemical side effects, dangerous chemical products may be formed that could harm your engine and it's systems, 'good' additives in your fuel may be deactivated by the additives in the other product - without laboratory testing, it is not possible to know. All bets are off, all claims are just stories - You, the end user, are using your motorcycle's engine as a test bed, and are left to evaluate the results. I know enough about a lot of these chemicals that I would *never* even consider doing this.

But hey, it's a free choice world. Just be aware of what you are doing.
 

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I was thinking of giving mine a shot of Pappy Van Winkle 23 year old reserve to commemorate our 2nd year anniversary. :cheers:
Just don't run that shot of "Pappy Van Winkle 23 year old reserve" thru your kidneys FIRST...!

:D

visitor zero - THANKS for a VERY interesting post!!!

:clap:
 

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Additional info re: the original post and the thread being referenced on the LS1 forum.
I read through a few pages on that topic. Just my opinion, but there are a lot of people posing as experts that are decidedly not. A lot of very bad information in that thread.
No one needs to believe anyone on the Internet - but take a lot of that info with a trailer-load of salt.
 

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There is a fourth type - and that is off-brand use of a non-specified product. An example of this is using outboard engine oil mixed with gasoline - but there are plenty of others.
In this case, one is using a product for a purpose it is not designed for.
While i agree with most of your statements ... they are true ... the one above got me confused. I know you generalize a bit, but this is oil that is meant to be mixed with gasoline .... we are not talking moth balls mixed with dragon blood.
 

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You're right - two-stoke/cycle oil is designed to be mixed with gasoline, in a particular ratio, for a very specific purpose - to be burned in a two-stroke/cycle engine as a total-loss lubricant in that system.

Running that mix through a four stroke/cycle engine subjects that oil and it's additives to a totally different environment, one which it was not designed for, and not tested against for compatibility or usability with systems, metal treatments, products or additives present in that four stroke/cycle engine.

This is just one example of a product being used for something it wasn't designed for. There are others. Some more ridiculous and harmful than this one, which is pretty benign, true, but I seriously question what problem can truly be solved by it. Therefore it's my personal take-away that I wouldn't do it, knowing what I know about oils, fuels, and additives, and engines.

It's my *opinion* that if your engine has a problem that doing this solves, I would think there is most likely a fundamental problem with the engine that needs attention.

Increased fuel mileage is a slippery animal... small changes in speed, temperature, relative humidity, tail- or headwind, tire inflation, differences in loaded weight, etc., can have significant effects on mileage in a small driven system like a motorcycle. I think it would be difficult to attribute to a fuel additive. There's X amount of BTU's available in a gallon of fuel, and we pretty well know and understand how much work we're going to get out of it in a modern engine.

Think of it this way - an oil company, were they to discover such an additive that gave a guaranteed, tested and verified 5% increase in mileage - would be all over it, it would be all over the media and there would be tons of commercials about it, trying to get you to switch to that company for your gasoline needs exclusively... but we don't see that, do we? And therefore... :)
 

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A lot of diesel pickup truck owners around these parts have been mixing 2-cycle oil in the fuel since the sulphur was virtually removed from diesel fuel - and the incidents of injector pump failures were on the rise.
 
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