Should new riders have cc restriction - Kawasaki Versys Forum
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post #1 of 12 (permalink) Old 08-08-2014, 05:46 PM Thread Starter
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Should new riders have cc restriction

So I'm sitting at the gas station having a monster and smoking a cig. Just a little break before my final stretch home tonight, and I'm just watching cars and motorcycles go by. Watching technique, ya know?

I saw this kid in his 20's in shorts a tee and of course, a helmet to complement his safety gear. He was on a new looking Z1000, a cool bike that is like to own for a year just for kicks, and he's coming in sooo blatantly hot up to the intersection to turn right. Now this is one of those turns you see coming and would realize it tightens up because it's not a perpendicular meeting of roads.

He must have been going 50, and he was right on someone's ass. The following, and seemingly basic mistakes were made:

Didn't slow before the turn

Grabbed a hand full of brake to avoid rear ending the car in front of him

Subsequently I'm sure he felt it tipping, as his angle was pretty extreme

Pops it upright and narrowly avoids hitting cars in the left turn lane of the incoming traffic for the road he was turning onto

And then he kicks his right leg out, causing his foot to bounce and skid

Gets shaky at the bars and somehow, he never put it down and continued on his way.

All of this only takes a few moments to transpire, but it seemed to me that maybe he was making a lot of potentially fatal mistakes . Power and speed hungry, but not refined enough to control it.

So as a good discussion point, should newer riders be limited in the CCs of a bike for say 1-3 years? Would this help? Or should the dmv require proof of power restriction in the mapping of any new riders bike ( ie , buy any bike, but dealer must provide proof of de tuning before allowing sale/registration). Dunno. GO!

*update
I wanted to say to this is a lot like gun control. A gun, or the machine is not really at fault, as it and all of the consequences of using it are on the individual. Without a person, a motorcycle is harmless, just as it would be with the "perfect" person.

Last edited by Prime95; 08-08-2014 at 05:52 PM.
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post #2 of 12 (permalink) Old 08-08-2014, 06:45 PM
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Good argument on this. I have thought about a larger bike several times, but have pulled back because the Versys itself still exceeds my capabilities as a rider and I don't think I am ready for a larger bike.
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post #3 of 12 (permalink) Old 08-08-2014, 06:49 PM Thread Starter
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Even the versys has it's issues for newer riders. I hadn't ridden in 4 years when I got my V and at that went from a 70's kz 400 to the V. I ended up laying the bike down 3 months into owning it, all stupid mistakes. If not for frame sliders is have a loan payment on scrap metal.

In my case though, dumb as I was, a slight de tuning may have prevented my screw up.
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post #4 of 12 (permalink) Old 08-08-2014, 07:30 PM
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I learned to ride on a DT125 Yamaha from the "Old" man down the street. He was from Italy and taught me to ride on his "Race" bike...a 50cc track monster. Laugh all you want if I could keep up with him and his brother in their draft it'd run close to 100! If I lost the draft and it'd run about 70 tops. This was on a track of course, the Yamaha would almost hit 50 but that was fine with me at 16. He taught me to ride safe. To be aware of what was going on around me at all time, to always plan an escape route and never EVER drink and ride.

I've had big bikes, my last was a Buell XB12STT. But I really don't need a bike that can run 130+ very often! I had a Goldwing years ago but found it was way more bike that I liked so sold it and got a CX650 Silverwing instead. I find the midsize bikes fit my taste and needs better. 500 to 750 hit the spot. Enough power with lighter weight, I like the flickability they have over the raw power of the big bike. After all I'm in this for the FUN not the "Coolness" or speed.

I see the kids today and wonder how long before they kill themselves. But at least, around here anyway, most wear a jacket, gloves and helmet The other thing I see, in some ways worse, is the is the middle age guy on his first bike, a big cruiser, in so far over his head he's a danger to himself and everyone around. I find these guys don't need any help at all from me or you on our "Little" bikes OR the MSF course. Around here they crash at twice the rate as the kids do. These are the guys I read about who hit a building, guardrail or just ran off the road and end up in the ditch with the lady on back ending up in the hospital or worse. And for safety gear well...they wear their vest and Doo Rag and are all "Patched In"

Or was that look THEN leap?
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post #5 of 12 (permalink) Old 08-08-2014, 08:02 PM
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It really depends on the person. The Versys (650) was the first motorcycle I ever rode, minus the single MSF class I took on some little 250, and I feel 100% comfortable with its power.

2012 Kawasaki Versys 650 - 20,500 miles
2000 Volvo V70XC 2.4T - 258,000 miles
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post #6 of 12 (permalink) Old 08-08-2014, 10:10 PM
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Here in Australia we originally had CC restriction for learners and provisional riders of <250cc.
This became a problem with some of the high output 250 race inspired bikes.

What they did some years ago was move to a power-to-weigh ratio and limit cc to max 660cc.

This allows for bigger framed person to ride something other than a broomstick!
All learner bikes are restricted from the factory as LAMS approved.

I'm over 40, and just got my riders license 8 months ago and ride a LAMS approved Versys 650L - Nothing wrong with it.

There are many bikes on offer to choose from... even HD and Ducati have LAMS approved bikes.

I don't see it as a problem to introduce it as the system is used here in Australia as well as in the EU. The bike's manufacturing plate is marked as LAMS approved. If you want to Unrestrict the bike you can officially change it but you then cannot go back.

One spin off from having LAMS bikes is that they really hold their resale value.

Learner Approved Bike for Sale:
http://goo.gl/EeOLGN


More Info:
http://www.rms.nsw.gov.au/licensing/...iceriders.html

Last edited by Gigitt; 08-08-2014 at 10:14 PM.
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post #7 of 12 (permalink) Old 08-09-2014, 05:18 AM
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post #8 of 12 (permalink) Old 08-09-2014, 07:23 AM
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I would like to see you have to take a road test on the bike you're gonna ride.
I've had a few contacts that got their licenses on 400 class bikes knowing full well that they were getting a "REAL" bike in the near future.
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post #9 of 12 (permalink) Old 08-09-2014, 10:52 AM
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I don't see a reason for a restriction. I think it is someone imagining a problem where there isn't one.
How many new riders actually have accidents that can be attributed to horsepower? I doubt it's a lot.
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post #10 of 12 (permalink) Old 08-09-2014, 11:13 AM
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Being from Scotland I grew up with the idea of graded licensing so for me it was normal and not something to rebel against. However I did not start riding till I moved to America and was very conscious of and grateful for the lack of bureaucracy getting in the way of my decisions.

Over the years I have watched the restrictions and costs involved in getting a UK bike license increase. Year after year, more restrictions are added all in the name of safety. I have faith that the legislators in the UK have the best interests of riders at heart, and are truly trying to improve safety, but if one restriction improves safety then surely two would be better? It's a very slippery slope. I get the impression that in the US special interest groups have more power and restrictions would be added, not to improve safety, but to drive us off the road. I have no faith in the legislative process here.

In place of engine restrictions I would prefer to see more stringent testing. Getting a license should focus more on skill development and I would also include car licenses in this. If you truly want to improve safety then the focus should be on training, not restrictions. You can't legislate against stupid.
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post #11 of 12 (permalink) Old 08-09-2014, 11:53 AM
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Originally Posted by alba View Post
Being from Scotland I grew up with the idea of graded licensing so for me it was normal and not something to rebel against. However I did not start riding till I moved to America and was very conscious of and grateful for the lack of bureaucracy getting in the way of my decisions.

Over the years I have watched the restrictions and costs involved in getting a UK bike license increase. Year after year, more restrictions are added all in the name of safety. I have faith that the legislators in the UK have the best interests of riders at heart, and are truly trying to improve safety, but if one restriction improves safety then surely two would be better? It's a very slippery slope. I get the impression that in the US special interest groups have more power and restrictions would be added, not to improve safety, but to drive us off the road. I have no faith in the legislative process here.

In place of engine restrictions I would prefer to see more stringent testing. Getting a license should focus more on skill development and I would also include car licenses in this. If you truly want to improve safety then the focus should be on training, not restrictions. You can't legislate against stupid.
I agree 100% on better training. I would add though, I don't think skills training, as in parking lot training, is as important as teaching people to ride "smart". I guess more defensive riding and less concentration on motorcycle handling.
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post #12 of 12 (permalink) Old 08-09-2014, 12:22 PM
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I think a rider can restrict themselves without government intervention. Buy a b:tch bike to learn to ride and crash. Buy more bike as you advance in skill. Repeat.

If a noob buys a liter bike from a dealership as his first bike, and more than likely last bike, who is the government, me, or you suppose to tell him not to do it? He obviously isn't very bright to begin with....thinning the herd.
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