Do Dealers Bend on MSRP? - Kawasaki Versys Forum
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post #1 of 16 (permalink) Old 02-19-2016, 05:35 PM Thread Starter
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Do Dealers Bend on MSRP?

Never bought a new vehicle before. I am just curious if any member who purchased a new bike paid full MSRP. I hear stories all the time of people beating down the dealer. Urban myth or is their a little wiggle room on out the door pricing. Just got back from the bike show, and made the decision on the 2016 650 Versys ABS LT. Going to talk to some local dealers in the spring, and do not want to come across as a uninformed buyer.
Thanks...Paul
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post #2 of 16 (permalink) Old 02-19-2016, 05:57 PM
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Depends on the dealer. Most will give a pretty good discount from Christmas through January. The warmer it gets the less the discount. Some dealers really don't want to sell the bikes but they do so they can move the 4-wheelers and side by sides.

I purchased last June and got it a little under list, but I'm an easy mark.
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post #3 of 16 (permalink) Old 02-19-2016, 06:09 PM
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You should almost always get them down if they really want to sell a bike. Don't just focus on MSRP get them down or get ride of the Delivery Fee as well as Dealer Prep. I call or go to multiple dealerships and give them a price i'm willing to pay for the bike with taxes and everything included let them know i've done the same with other dealers and the first one to take my offer gets the deal, I was signing the paperwork on a bike when another dealer called to let me know we had a deal. Told him he was 15 minutes late. Also see if they'll throw in a helmet on the deal.

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post #4 of 16 (permalink) Old 02-19-2016, 06:33 PM
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Shop around I picked up a 2015 650 lt in December for about $1700.00 under msrp with no added fees like shipping or prep. Just Nc taxes and title.
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post #5 of 16 (permalink) Old 02-19-2016, 06:45 PM Thread Starter
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You should almost always get them down if they really want to sell a bike. Don't just focus on MSRP get them down or get ride of the Delivery Fee as well as Dealer Prep. I call or go to multiple dealerships and give them a price i'm willing to pay for the bike with taxes and everything included let them know i've done the same with other dealers and the first one to take my offer gets the deal, I was signing the paperwork on a bike when another dealer called to let me know we had a deal. Told him he was 15 minutes late. Also see if they'll throw in a helmet on the deal.
So it is better to work on negotiating on dealer prep and shipping, than on MSRP? Never haggled before, so all is new to me.
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post #6 of 16 (permalink) Old 02-19-2016, 07:02 PM
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So it is better to work on negotiating on dealer prep and shipping, than on MSRP? Never haggled before, so all is new to me.

Nope....Haggle on all 3 it gives you more options.
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post #7 of 16 (permalink) Old 02-19-2016, 07:02 PM
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In my experience new bikes that are selling well won't find their way into the "great deal" category. Despite killer deal stories, there isn't much dealer wiggle room unless there is factory support. Aging stock (new year-old models) can be a good deal if you don't absolutely have to have the current year. I believe the bottom line is if you feel you're getting a reasonable deal, then you are. There isn't a one answer that fits all solutions though it would be nice if there was.

My brother-in-law and another friend, both of whom fancy themselves much more important than they really are, love to tell everyone what spectacular deals they "forced" dealers to give them. The amusing thing is that people, who don't ask why on earth a dealer would feel compelled to cave in to such generic and unimportant citizens, tend to believe their bull$*it stories.

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post #8 of 16 (permalink) Old 02-19-2016, 07:08 PM
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They all start off the same way with a sheet of paper when they start to close you. They'll put down a high down payment and a high monthly payment. Thats what they want you to focus on. They can take it from $2000.00 down and a $500.00 month payment all the way down to a 0 down payment to a 100.00 a month payment and never take a penny off the price all they did was make the payment a longer term. Say from 12 months to 72. Its their closing game. Make them stick to a dollar amount not payments.
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post #9 of 16 (permalink) Old 02-19-2016, 07:09 PM
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Awesome bike. You'll love it.

Much depends on how much you want the bike - and when. Most dealers won't discount a brand new 2016 very much - but all of them will work with you on accessories. Buying a new 2015 is a different story. You can save a bunch on those.

Give yourself 30 days to make a decision. Do your homework on Cycle Trader and decide what "ballpark" makes you comfortable. Call or email a bunch of dealers and ask them if $200 less than your price is reasonable. If they say yes, ask the next one for $300. Won't take long to see what price range you're going to need to be in.

Or, once your comfortable that your price range is correct, ask for discounts on the accessories you want and pull the trigger on the bike you want. All you really want to know is you're not getting gouged.

Buying is an important step but hell, these are motorcycles! It's all about the riding! When you're on a backroad smiling ear to ear this summer, I suspect you'll be glad you didn't let a couple of hundred stand in the way of getting what you want.

My humble opinion.
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post #10 of 16 (permalink) Old 02-19-2016, 07:13 PM
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My 2015 was advertised in the above free , several dealers did this on 2015 stock. Going to their website these bikes and deals didn't exist. The comment on January and February is correct. I can only say there is one left in Ontario for $1300 more than I paid. Still some deals on the 2015 650 ABS LT.

650 Abs Versys | Kijiji: Free Classifieds in Ontario. Find a job, buy a car, find a house or apartment, furniture, appliances and more!
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post #11 of 16 (permalink) Old 02-19-2016, 07:43 PM
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My 2015 was advertised in the above free , several dealers did this on 2015 stock. Going to their website these bikes and deals didn't exist. The comment on January and February is correct. I can only say there is one left in Ontario for $1300 more than I paid. Still some deals on the 2015 650 ABS LT.

650 Abs Versys | Kijiji: Free Classifieds in Ontario. Find a job, buy a car, find a house or apartment, furniture, appliances and more!
I hate haggling.My dealer had the bike advertised on craigslist with the sale price. I emailed the dealer. I thought they made a mistake on the price.So I wanted them to verify it was for the 650lt and not the regular versys It was . I was still a little Leary .i thought they were going to add a lot of extra fees to get the price back up. So I asked for the otd price. They sold it at the sale price and no extra fees.
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post #12 of 16 (permalink) Old 02-19-2016, 08:55 PM
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Originally Posted by Moochy View Post
Never bought a new vehicle before. I am just curious if any member who purchased a new bike paid full MSRP. I hear stories all the time of people beating down the dealer. Urban myth or is their a little wiggle room on out the door pricing. Just got back from the bike show, and made the decision on the 2016 650 Versys ABS LT. Going to talk to some local dealers in the spring, and do not want to come across as a uninformed buyer.
Thanks...Paul
Read through this (and especially post 47):

http://www.kawasakiversys.com/forums...king-dump.html

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Originally Posted by Moochy View Post
So it is better to work on negotiating on dealer prep and shipping, than on MSRP? Never haggled before, so all is new to me.
Focus on Out The Door Pricing. If they gave you a free bike, then charged you $10,000 for Tax, Title, Freight, Set-up, and License...that's not such a good deal in the end. I've bought most new bikes without paying a penny for Freight and Setup. Many dealers have really tried to use these things as revenue generators. I sold for a period of time, and the dealership I worked for never charged for these bogus fees....give me a break--setup??? Really? Just tell them no thanks, I'll take the bike in the crate and save the $500 you're trying to gouge me for in setup fees, and will install the mirrors/check tire pressure myself. Often, there is little involved in set-up, other than removing from crate and doing basics (ie- verify oil level, air pressure in tires, clean the brake rotors, etc). It's not like the thing comes in 100 parts/pieces...

Supply and demand, in your market area, will greatly shape relative value. As someone else mentioned in the thread, use some resources to shop (ie- ebay, craigslist, cycle trader,etc). Volume dealers/power sellers (who sell a lot of units) are a good gauge in determining market price. Price sells! (along with the other 6 P's of the Marketing Mix) There's a reason why power sellers do a big volume. They are good at balancing the supply/demand equation and moving product (on a big scale).

To summarize, most things in life are negotiable. I price shop and negotiate on many things...some as random as trash disposal services, others as common as vehicles. Just do your homework and be an educated shopper...AND be honest! Don't be a dreamer and offer something unrealistic, like 50% OFF a new motorcycle. Their mark-up isn't that large.
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post #13 of 16 (permalink) Old 02-19-2016, 09:07 PM
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The dealer is concerned with the total price, not just the price of the bike. Watch out for dealer prep, assembly, documentation fees, hold back, etc. He might claim to give you $1000 off MSRP but then pump it back up with all manner of fees.

Doc fees in my state are set by the state as max allowable. Listen carefully to the dealer when you ask about it, and they'll say something misleading like "the state sets the doc fees, there's nothing I can do about it". Bull****. All these fees are extras which do not have to be charged.

The dealer needs to make some profit. You can find a basic idea of what his base cost for the bike is if you look online. He may or may not get added rebates from the factory, bringing his actual cost down some. These rebates are frequently based on either volume of sales or as incentives to get old stock moved out.

From there, it is game on for the dealer adding whatever he can get away with. There is no reason to pay any assembly or dealer prep fees. No reason to pay doc fees.

Delivery fees are real, and are part of the cost of the bike to him. So look for what his cost is including destination (delivery) fees. Then figure he needs to make maybe $500 on top of that to pay his overhead. This is probably near rock bottom what you could get.

I paid about $1500 under MSRP for my '15 650 LT last summer. No doc, assembly, etc. But this dealer is known for giving a great price without haggling. Most motorcycle dealers around here are like car dealers, with high pressure sales and shady fast talk.

If you're going to buy accessories such as a helmet, jacket, tools, etc you might get a great discount on these items instead of a discount off of the bike's MSRP. Another item you might ask for is a free or greatly discounted first oil change and inspection. Dealers frequently make more profit on maintenance and accessories than they do on the sale of the bike itself. They want you to bring the bike to them for service, so they are motivated to give you a great deal on that first service and make you a service customer.
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post #14 of 16 (permalink) Old 02-19-2016, 09:53 PM
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IF you don't need financing, for me, it's out the door price and all the extras I can get. Dealers may be limited to regional make and model prices, but they can at least throw in $300 in accessories sometimes. Look on Kawasaki USA for current deals. Of course they have unadvertised dealer discounts you never know about too. So act cheesy, undecided, and do all your calculations beforehand so you are not distracted. ALSO, have another make like Suzuki 650 V calculated as option one and two on the SAME sheet of paper with Kelly Blue book prices and best dealers of each: and then say he gets first crack.

But if you have the money, try to get an used 2016 (or 2015 is same thing but color) and automatically get $3k off. Ii depends on your area. California Jap dealers for example usually don't give any discounts because they have a closed market, and if you strike up a deal, they will rip you off somewhere else like dealer, delivery, or tag (costs less than $100). Other dealers on the internet I 'hear' do better though.

Just don't test ride it, and come back with a big $hit eating grin! Then they got you by the 'nads. Good luck. Dealing with oem bike dealers bites for most people.
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post #15 of 16 (permalink) Old 02-19-2016, 11:31 PM Thread Starter
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Thanks everyone for the great advise. Some very good points. I do understand the dealer needs to make a profit, all I want is a fair deal on both sides. The shipping costs I understand, but the set up prep I really feel is unjustified. bwwoodard,, I like the crate idea good point. At this point I am not rushed to purchase, still have my old long in the tooth 83 Yamaha Vision. Last years model if discounted works for me. Could buy low mileage used and save, but I have been busting truck tires for the last Thirty years and heck I deserve at least one new bike while my back is somewhat still working.
Thanks...Paul
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post #16 of 16 (permalink) Old 02-21-2016, 03:51 PM
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Never bought a new vehicle before.
Thanks...Paul
Paul - good luck, and ENJOY it when you get it!

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