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Race Tech R&D of Versys Forks and Shock

26K views 71 replies 22 participants last post by  kojack 
#1 ·
I just shipped my forks and shock to Race Tech. They are going to do a complete R&D of both to see if they can use their typically excellent gold valve products for the stock items (no R&D labor cost to me since it is a new application). I hope they can, since I want a real damping performance improvement without spending $2K on a new shock and complete cartridge replacement. If they can develop the products, they normally offer them for sale to everyone, though some applications will require them to do the labor depending on the modifications needed. It will probably take about a month before they are done, and I'll post an update then. I shouldn't miss riding any since I woke up this morning to a foot of snow and 10deg temp.
 
#8 ·
The Race Tech rep called today to give me an update. For the forks, they confirmed what I have stated earlier that the left fork has no damping whatsoever. The left "cartridge" is just a slider that keeps things together--otherwise it's a pogo-stick. They are waiting on a backordered Kawasaki replacement right-side cartrige to put in the left fork (this is cost effective, as it's barely over $100 from Kaw, plus probably the spacer and top-cap). The stock cartridge valves will then be replaced with their gold valve products, shim stacks tuned, and I should end up with a perfect performing set of forks.
Also good news is that the stock shock is rebuildable, and they are able to install their gold valve in it as well. I wrote in a previous post how I tapered the shock spring ends so they don't contact the adjacent coils, which by mid-stroke, makes my spring about 10% softer than stock. The rep said that with this mod, the spring is spot-on for my 165lb weight, though of course personal preference comes into play
Once they get the backordered part and get the forks built, they are going to put my suspension on another Versys, do a full test, make necessary tweaks, and be done. Soon after that, I expect they will post the data to their website like they do for other bikes, which shows products available, stock and recommended spring rates, etc.
I'll post again when they are finished.
 
#11 ·
One thing I need to keep in mind when making recommendations is that, well, being the versys, we will all have different riding styles, and therefore, different suspension needs. I never carry a passenger and seldom more than about a 20 lb tail pack. I am most interested in best control in agressive sport-style riding, combined with enough compliance to be comfortable when riding distance, but never mushy, and chose the Versys because its longer-travel suspension, when properly set-up, will handle the often rough mountain pavement I ride on much better than a typical sport-bike. For me, the stock suspension has the right level of firmness, its just that the forks are too harsh over sharp-edged bumps, while the shock is quickly overwhelmed by successive bumps. I can't wait to get my suspension back, and hope I have a warm enough day to test it out when it does get here.
 
#12 ·
Wyo ...in your early post you said the stock shock was rebuildable and they could put their gold valves in it ...that the rear I"m assuming?
as my local Racetech guy thought that i couldn't be ..but he only looked at it on the bike quickly.

Thanks for doing this too, much appreciated. It should save us all a lot of coin. :thumb:
 
#16 ·
Wyo,

I am not an expert on the subject so please advice what I am missing.

I can understand why we need to upgrade the rear shock with gold valve (always a good thing to do) . I also understand why we need to upgrade the forks with gold valve.
But I do not understend what improvment of damping should you get when you will upgrade the left side fork to be same as the right one. As far as my understending, if it was planed to damp with one side, two sides should should not do any positive different.

Thanks
 
#17 ·
Wyo,

...I do not understend what improvment of damping should you get when you will upgrade the left side fork to be same as the right one. As far as my understending, if it was planed to damp with one side, two sides should should not do any positive different.

Thanks
I was wondering the same thing. Maybe the Race Tech hardware or analysis tools only work when you do both fork legs?
 
#24 ·
if you get both legs passing oil, you can get finer adjustment and a wider range of adjustment, not to mention you'll be spreading the "wear" out on twice the amount of oil and another valve stack. the oil will stay cooler and the damping will be more consistent.
I wonder if Invader will install a L side valving pack in the R side and beat them to it?
I'm kinda shocked they can rebuild the stock shock, no pun intended. It looked sealed, but hey, that's awesome news.
 
#25 · (Edited)
They also might not be accustomed to tuning a single shim stack to handle all the damping force required by the bike. When I sent them in, I included my concern over asymetric forces on the front end caused by damping in only one fork, so maybe they are addressing my individual concern; I didn't have a chance to talk long. When they call me back with my "options", maybe they will give the option to do only the right fork leg--we'll find out hopefully soon. I used to think this was a budget bike issue as well, but I just noticed that the new Yamaha R1 uses compression only in one fork and rebound only in the other. So maybe it's not as bad as I originally thought. Either way, as a data hound, I trust Race Tech to give me the best setup, because they actually tell you exactly what you are getting. This as opposed to Hyperpro, which I'm sure builds good products, but won't even give you spring rate data on their springs. Yes, if you just put the right side stock cartidge in the left fork, it would have way too much damping, but to reduce it is just a matter of having the correct shim stack setup. Additionally, good valving setups use thin (like 2.5w) oil with high viscosity index to greatly reduce the amount of damping change with temperature. To answer Sambamboo's question, I believe the different Race Tech centers are there to use their products and do limited service and setup procedures. I sent my suspension to the main Race Tech headquarters which is the only place they do their Research and Development. What you all might run into though, is that for some of the Race Tech products, it requires their installation. Again, I'll post when I have more info.
 
#26 · (Edited)
This process is taking a while, but here is some recent e-mail coorespondence between me and RT after my last post. I think it will be worth the wait, and only hope I have a break in the winter weather to get a couple in-town rides in when I get my suspension back.

My e-mail to Race Tech:
I understand you are waiting for a right-side cartridge from Kawasaki to use for the left fork. I'm interested in your opinion on whether having damping in only one fork is a bad idea or not. It seems to me that it would cause unnecessary asymmetric forces, especially on the compression stroke, and may make the shim stack more difficult to tune vs. if the damping was shared between both sides. However, I noticed that some higher-end bikes use the same concept, most notably some of the Triumph bikes, and the new Yamaha R1 as well. I'm not opposed to keeping the Versys damping in one fork leg only, though I will defer to your recommendation for the best setup. I also wonder if having to add right-side factory componenets to the left will make it more difficult for you to market to other Versys customers, even though for me, I'm willing to spend the extra time and effort to get better performance. There are multiple Versys riders on kawasakiversys.com anxiously awaiting the outcome of this. Thanks much for all your help.

Their response last night:
I got to spend some time with Tony looking over your forks. Kawasaki has taken the one fork damping to an extreme in the case of the Versys, the other bikes have compression damping in one fork, rebound in the other (Z1000, FZ1, Triumph 1050, HD XR1200, etc) while your bike has one fork doing both & the other a ‘dummy’ There is no way to make this work properly & just adding the stock damper to the other fork with out major revalving would not be great either. Good news is the parts needed from Kawasaki are cheap & the Gold Valve Kit will fill in the missing pieces & provide exceptional performance. Tony is totally on the right track, You will be pleased with the results I guarantee it!
 
#27 ·
It is getting very interesting. So we know that you Wyorider are going to have "exceptional performance" on the forks. That is good, very good news.

What about the shock? the shock is the weakest point on this bike. Wyorider, would you be kind to ask them about the shock? are they feel so positive on this one too?
 
#37 ·
Once again it's interesting how our different riding styles/bike usage changes our feelings about suspension performance. Truthfully, after my spring mod, I felt the forks were the weak link, not necessarily the shock. For me, the forks have too little initial (slow speed) damping and too much high-speed (sharp edge bump) damping. I like the shock's firmness level, though it does pack up too much over successive bumps when the rebound is set to have good control and prevent wallowing on fast corners, so I'm hoping the RT shock mod will change the damping curve to have the best of both worlds. I'm curious to hear from them on what in the world Kawasaki considers their "two stage damping circuit" and what RT did with that. Of course I haven't asked what my final bill will be, but I'm getting free labor and a parts discount because of letting them use my suspension as the guinea pig. This will certainly be cheaper than an aftermarket shock, but with an aftermarket shock you loose no riding time, while you will likely have to ship your shock to RT to get the mod unless you have all the specialized tools (including a way to inject nitrogen at the right pressure).
 
#29 ·
If all works well perhaps a group buy. I barely have 2000 miles on my 09 V but I have not yet noticed any negative problems with this budget suspension.(I'll push it harder when I become more familiar) For the most part, is this mod necessary for off road? Funny thing, with this "shovel ready" stimulus money being offered to the states, many of my favorite twisty riding roads roads have been resurfaced so it kinda makes it hard to tell. Recession- bad for the country, good for bikers. Go figure.
 
#30 ·
How much do you weigh?

I have 6000 miles on my V, and I ride 99.9% on paved roads, weigh 175, and I get hammered by the stock shock when riding on most of the paved roads in Wisconsin (especially any sharp bumps, or frost heaved sections of pavement. I am looking for less compression damping, less initial spring rate, and more use of available suspension travel.
 
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