Mini-stalling after PC and filter installation - Kawasaki Versys Forum
 
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post #1 of 10 (permalink) Old 06-26-2010, 11:10 AM Thread Starter
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Mini-stalling after PC and filter installation

Installed my PCIII the other day, along with a Pipercross filter. After a day or two, depending on what map I used, the bike would occasionally stall for half a second at low to mid rpm with low throttle opening mainly 2nd or 3rd gear and then get going again, which actually was kinda scary first time (middle of a roundabout). Messed around with the mapping to see if it made any difference, which it seems it did.

My kinda ordinary gear:
GPR slip-on installed when new, by dealer
Pipercross filter
PCIII


When I use the PC map for european models with GPR slip-on it happens now and then, maybe once per short trip.

When trying a custom map from the forum (although a dyno-map for a full arrow exhaust etc etc) would stall it 4-5 times per same trip.

Actually trying to get it to stall around the rpm/throttle opening where it usually does is not easy, so it's kinda sporadic as well..

Does the supreme collective knowledge of the forum have any clue as to what might be causing this? I'm not sure what you call this phenomena though, I've tried searching for stalling, hiccups, stuttering, and so on, but no one seems to be having my problem or at least not in the same way. If the problem only lies in the mapping I'd just have it dyno'd, but first I want to make sure that it really is, since a dyno is around $330 over here.

Thankful for any and all input!
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post #2 of 10 (permalink) Old 06-26-2010, 11:30 AM
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you didnit say if you richened or weakend to make a difference? But using generic maps wont always be spot on, but assuming your using correct'ish map for your coinfig? It may well be your TPs is rich/weak. therefore your addding or subtracting too much with addition of the map. (Personcally, I'd be surprised if the slip/filter made it much weaker anyway, certainly nothing the ECU could'nt overcome)

Ideally, check the TPs first but I would remove the PC, see whats what? Then add Pc with zero map, check? add map, adjsut, work out which way is best.
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post #3 of 10 (permalink) Old 06-26-2010, 12:08 PM Thread Starter
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Then I'll just upload a stock map and see if the problem persists, otherwise I'll just uninstall the PCIII and see what happens. Is this a fairly common thing or is it just me? =P

I wouldn't expect the map for my config to be so off that it causes stalls, but hey, every bike's different I guess..
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post #4 of 10 (permalink) Old 06-26-2010, 03:29 PM
naz
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did you install the filter correctly? pipercross is very thick ,i used it for 2-3k km and then returned to the oem filter.to slick inside the airbox and fit properly it needs some grease or oil on the sides,if you dont oil it probably didnt fit and thus you got a hole in the throtle response..its an assumption of course but i insist on rechecking the filter installation
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post #5 of 10 (permalink) Old 06-27-2010, 12:25 AM
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Take your tank back off and make sure everything is connected properly. Check the PCIII connection to your TPS, and if I were you, I would solder that connection. I'll bet something got missed in your reassemble. It's not the map.

2007 Versys Black, V35 Bags, H&B Bars, Skidmarx Hugger.Fender Ex., Avon Distanzia, Braided Lines, Hella 65W bulbs Arrow Can, DNA Air filter, GIVI tall screen (for winter), PCIII, Baldwin Saddle. **SOLD**

2011 KTM SM-T. Crash bars, E55 Top Box, Fender extender front and rear.
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post #6 of 10 (permalink) Old 06-27-2010, 02:53 AM Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by naz View Post
did you install the filter correctly? pipercross is very thick ,i used it for 2-3k km and then returned to the oem filter.to slick inside the airbox and fit properly it needs some grease or oil on the sides,if you dont oil it probably didnt fit and thus you got a hole in the throtle response..its an assumption of course but i insist on rechecking the filter installation
That was one of the things I was thinking about.. that thing was twice the thickness of the OEM filter! I'll take it out and oil it up and see if it works any better. It's possible that it didn't quite go down when refitting the top part of the airbox.. If there's a gap somewhere I guess that could cause the stalling, and maybe even depending on the PC map since it messes with the A/F ratio.. hrm.

And oh yeah, the mrs. threw my OEM away a week ago doh!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Red Herring View Post
Take your tank back off and make sure everything is connected properly. Check the PCIII connection to your TPS, and if I were you, I would solder that connection. I'll bet something got missed in your reassemble. It's not the map.
And that was the other thing =)

All connections are solid, but that wire tap didn't feel too good. Since the glitch only shows up around certain rpms/throttle openings/gears (so far) I'm leaning towards the filter installation, but I'll take it all apart anyways and see if something's up with anything else. Step one is buying a better filter before I start.. I'll keep ya posted!
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post #7 of 10 (permalink) Old 06-27-2010, 03:01 AM
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for a proper installation of the pipercross seek help from invader.mine didnt work at all ,i finally have it here in the box ,didnt work for me.
anyways the oem filter is washable and not restrictive at all.mrs should stay away from the garage
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post #8 of 10 (permalink) Old 06-28-2010, 01:02 PM Thread Starter
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Small update:

The "glitch" seems more and more sporadic. Leaning the map around 3750 rpm seems to make it more frequent tho, but atm it's at the point where it sometimes stalls repeatedly (and without picking up again) per trip, even when starting to move from a stop, and sometimes I can go for a ride with my girl behind me for hours and not experiencing any problems.

Come wednesday I might be able to get hold of a new OEM filter, but until then I'll just try and fiddle with the mapzz.. again, if anyone recognizes the problem, please leave me some feedback =)

Thanks for all the tips so far!
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post #9 of 10 (permalink) Old 06-28-2010, 04:58 PM Thread Starter
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SOLVED - I hope..

So far so good..

Actually, leaning the map didn't make the problem worse, more like the time it took me to do it and test it out. Barely got home from work today, so whatever was haunting my bike I figured must've be some form of faulty connection (or Kawasaki-ebola). I was kinda running low on gas so I thought I might as well take the tank off and check stuff out. When I loosened the screws on top of the airbox lid and took the lid off it came off alright, hose and all. The connection in the other end (which I hadn't fiddled with, I swear) wasn't really a connection at all, pretty much just dangling around of sorts. I pushed the black hose back on and reassembled the rest since dinner was ready anyway, ate, and went for a pretty long ride. Not a stall in sight, smooth running despite my desperate attempts to provoke stalling, which I had been successful with earlier.

I'm hoping that this really was the solution and that it wasn't the cold, dense air that made it run smoother.. I'll get back to you then!

EDIT:

Nope, that wasn't it Seems like last night was actually just a fluke, I had a very, very jerky ride to the local pizza place during lunch today after 2-3 smooth trips.

After I got back I was in the experimental mood, so I just disconnected the TPS and took a ride around the parking lot without it, and the behaviour was spot on.. bad wire tap probably, go figure (hats off to Red Herring ). I'm guessing ~3750 rpm might be a resonance frequency for the tap and that's what might be causing stalls.. When rolling full on the throttle in 6th gear in low rpm it stalls as well, so vibes are probably the problem... hrm.

Last edited by Cabom; 06-29-2010 at 08:51 AM.
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post #10 of 10 (permalink) Old 06-30-2010, 05:50 AM Thread Starter
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This is becoming more and more like my personal FailBLOG, but I guess writing everything down might help someone else in teh fuuture. Anyhoo, problem and tried solutions so far:

Problem:
At ~3800 rpm bike stalls for a split second and then takes off again, averages a couple of times per ride (sometimes not at all) and actually seems to be more frequent during warm starts + warm ambient temps. For a while the stalling occurred when giving full throttle in 6th gear around 3k rpm, putting more of a load on the engine and causing more vibrations, not any more tho. Problem started after installing PC3 + Pipercross air filter.

Solutions tried:
* Messing around with PC-mapping - no results.
* Re-checking Pipercross air filter install (thick as hell) - no results.
* Checking idle rpm - set too low, around 800 rpm warm idle, not adjusted yet.
* Re-checking connections - All solid except PC wire-tap has gnawed a bit on the TPS wire, now soldered, awaiting results. (the solder I had lying around was crap-deluxe, so I might have to re-redo that connection)

In general:
* The wire tap seems like a likely culprit since a completely disconnected TPS showed the same behaviour as the short "glitches", only all across the range of course.
* I'm doing the vacuum hose mod with the T hopefully today, and if I get ahold of a vacuum gauge I'm doing the sync as well.
* I'm going to fiddle with the idle rpm as explained by invader in various threads.

Aaand.. I'll keep ya posted =)
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