Keeping Optimum Voltage Charge - Kawasaki Versys Forum
 
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post #1 of 18 (permalink) Old 07-04-2015, 11:47 AM Thread Starter
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Keeping Optimum Voltage Charge

I finally got a c-tec red, yellow, green voltage check light, and it revealed, after sitting for 2 days on the weekend, that my charge at idle was yellow to red (low charge.) But it immediately bumps to green when the throttle rises a 1000 or so rpm from idle at 1000 rpm (that may be too low and a problem.)

Part of that may be heated grips, but most is due, I assume, to my bright lights on all the time: they are staying on, period. So I stopped at Cycle Gear and got a MAGNABOOST charger on half price sale for $40 which is pretty nice, and more powerful with more options than a Battery Tender. It took 30 seconds on the 2a (it also has 4a) charge to turn green, so I caught it before any significant battery damage took place. MAGNABOOST also detects bad battery cells.

So my question to the Guru's is are there any alternatives to keep voltage charged where it will read green charge at idle like:

1. increasing idle until green light never goes out (to over 2K rpm?), or
2. put a capacitor charging unit that activates at low rpm/idle?

Maybe just the battery tender MAGNABOOST sitting on it every chance I get will be what I need, as I did nothing before since I rode it every day, almost. My dual horns were weak sounds at idle after sitting over the weekend, as my BMW 650's dual horns were also weak at idle too (all the time): but I thought the superior Japanese electronics would overcome that problem - evidently not.

Like someone said here, I'm putting the voltage light indicator on my handlebars in front of my eyes to always monitor that, and afterwards, I'll likely bump up my idle (unless someone has a capacitor gadget to boost voltage at low rpm's.) Hopefully, I will not have any electronic problems from running at low voltage some owners seem to have various electronic problems. The bike ran perfect and I'm glad I put the c-tec voltage light meter on my wire connectors or I would have never known until I messed something else up like my battery or worse ($$$.)

Any useful input would be appreciated.
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post #2 of 18 (permalink) Old 07-04-2015, 12:33 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kawdog View Post
I finally got a c-tec red, yellow, green voltage check light, and it revealed, after sitting for 2 days on the weekend, that my charge at idle was yellow to red (low charge.) But it immediately bumps to green when the throttle rises a 1000 or so rpm from idle at 1000 rpm (that may be too low and a problem.)

Part of that may be heated grips, but most is due, I assume, to my bright lights on all the time: they are staying on, period. So I stopped at Cycle Gear and got a MAGNABOOST charger on half price sale for $40 which is pretty nice, and more powerful with more options than a Battery Tender. It took 30 seconds on the 2a (it also has 4a) charge to turn green, so I caught it before any significant battery damage took place. MAGNABOOST also detects bad battery cells.

So my question to the Guru's is are there any alternatives to keep voltage charged where it will read green charge at idle like:

1. increasing idle until green light never goes out (to over 2K rpm?), or
2. put a capacitor charging unit that activates at low rpm/idle?


Maybe just the battery tender MAGNABOOST sitting on it every chance I get will be what I need, as I did nothing before since I rode it every day, almost. My dual horns were weak sounds at idle after sitting over the weekend, as my BMW 650's dual horns were also weak at idle too (all the time): but I thought the superior Japanese electronics would overcome that problem - evidently not.



Like someone said here, I'm putting the voltage light indicator on my handlebars in front of my eyes to always monitor that, and afterwards, I'll likely bump up my idle (unless someone has a capacitor gadget to boost voltage at low rpm's.) Hopefully, I will not have any electronic problems from running at low voltage some owners seem to have various electronic problems. The bike ran perfect and I'm glad I put the c-tec voltage light meter on my wire connectors or I would have never known until I messed something else up like my battery or worse ($$$.)

Any useful input would be appreciated.
"Running Load"
Your ignition system, tail light, headlight, fuel pump, instrumentation, city lights.
Additional intermittent loads;
Fan, signal and brake lights, plus anything else you have added.

capacitor charging unit ------------had to do that
Not possible, simple method is remove some of your load, change city lights to LED, plate light to LED


You could also change the regulator to Polaris, as this way the stator only runs at actual load not full output.
Stator output equals running load around 1380 to 1420 rpm,(1450 RPM is my IDLE) add 5 amp load above OEM and raise RPM by roughly about 100 RPM, this only works for about 7 amp total increase above OEM (150 RPM increase or 1570 to1600 RPM), ( your fan running[additional load] will also be equal to roughly 5 amp) after that you need to be at or above 3000RPM for maximum output. Remember the stator is something like 330 watt at 27.5 amp / 12 volts. Volts X amps = Watts. To find amps, divide by volts. So maximum amps at 14.2 volts is 23.23 amps. Last time I checked, my running load was something like 9-- 11 amp. I have 65 watt Osram lights.

To relate to something we use every day at home;your toaster or electric kettle uses 4 times the maximum power of the stator output, OR the Stator output is 1/4 that of what you need for your toaster to run.

Thanks Joe< I assumed the OP new what idle was suppose to be, even mentioned it may be low. Added edit to my post of idle.

Last edited by onewizard; 07-04-2015 at 02:53 PM.
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post #3 of 18 (permalink) Old 07-04-2015, 02:39 PM
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If your idle is set at 1000rpm's thats too low bump it up to 1300rpm or 1350rpm..Its one of the two.

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Last edited by weljo2001; 07-04-2015 at 02:42 PM.
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post #4 of 18 (permalink) Old 07-04-2015, 03:25 PM Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by onewizard View Post

capacitor charging unit
So this is a professional job huh?
Well, I know a good Honda Goldwing mechanic, but he usually has a 1 month backlog wait time


I was hoping for something more like MEGABOOST charger (for $39.99 from Cycle Gear, ) And really, there is no reason it could not work like that with different load models, except marked up capitalism. Oh well, Ohm on the range.

First, I may go bump up my idle to 1500 rpm and mount my colored light voltage display on my handlebars somewhere. It looks like I need my old HP41cvx hand held computer to estimate my dynamic loads

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post #5 of 18 (permalink) Old 07-04-2015, 07:59 PM
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So this is a professional job huh?
Well, I know a good Honda Goldwing mechanic, but he usually has a 1 month backlog wait time


I was hoping for something more like MEGABOOST charger (for $39.99 from Cycle Gear, ) And really, there is no reason it could not work like that with different load models, except marked up capitalism. Oh well, Ohm on the range.

First, I may go bump up my idle to 1500 rpm and mount my colored light voltage display on my handlebars somewhere. It looks like I need my old HP41cvx hand held computer to estimate my dynamic loads
You started it, you shouldn't ask when I am involved----------unless you have a long extension cord ----------------
In reality our permanent magnet alternator is high frequency, a capacitor is used to store energy, in the case of DC rectification, it's purpose is to reduce the AC component from the DC , this AC component is also referred to as RIPPLE. YAH I already tried using a large filter capacitor used in old large computers, the capacitor was the size of a 2 liter bottle of pop, other than the arc when I made the connection, absolutely no difference, not even 0.01 volt more----------lets just say even if it made a difference, where are you going to mount something that big.


I referred to Polaris or Compufire, regulators, you will get a slight gain because the OEM regulator is running the stator output at maximum, this causes heat, a cold stator is lower in resistance than a hot stator. As the wire heats up, the resistance goes up, that resistance acts as a load, so with a OEM stator you may be losing 20 to 30 watts due to what is referred to as copper losses.

The next time you are running your leaf blower and the extension cord is hot, get a larger gauge cord, THAT HEAT IN THE CORD IS ENERGY BEING LOST IN THE FORM OF HEAT. Big fingers hit the caps lock button, as to my earlier statement--------if you have a OEM stator, the best $110 you will ever spend would be to buy a Polaris regulator and follow my post #387 under burnt stators to change it.
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post #6 of 18 (permalink) Old 07-05-2015, 01:46 AM
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Why are you worried???

Few, if any, bikes put out full voltage charge at idle. If you read technical manuals most of them do not reach full charge rate until engine is at operating revs.

Providing you do not run a lot of accessories whilst at idle for long periods of time (a very bad idea anyway) there is not a problem.

Anyway, this setup is an excuse to go for a ride and charge the battery. Works for me.

BruceC
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post #7 of 18 (permalink) Old 07-05-2015, 02:58 AM Thread Starter
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Few, if any, bikes put out full voltage charge at idle. If you read technical manuals most of them do not reach full charge rate until engine is at operating revs.

Providing you do not run a lot of accessories whilst at idle for long periods of time (a very bad idea anyway) there is not a problem.

Anyway, this setup is an excuse to go for a ride and charge the battery. Works for me.

BruceC

Something is wrong, and there may be a better way of installing all of my electrical options with a combined circuit so it does not drain my voltage so noticeably (i.e. - the horn does not work sometimes!)

A dual horn in Los Angeles is the difference between life and death on a motorcycle. Does anyone else ride without their horn less than 4k rpm?
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post #8 of 18 (permalink) Old 07-05-2015, 12:02 PM
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Something is wrong, and there may be a better way of installing all of my electrical options with a combined circuit so it does not drain my voltage so noticeably (i.e. - the horn does not work sometimes!)

A dual horn in Los Angeles is the difference between life and death on a motorcycle. Does anyone else ride without their horn less than 4k rpm?

Did you ever put a relay on that horn....If not i have a couple laying around so you can have one if you want...

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post #9 of 18 (permalink) Old 07-05-2015, 01:20 PM
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...But it immediately bumps to green when the throttle rises a 1000 or so rpm from idle at 1000 rpm (that may be too low and a problem.)....
Idle should be at least 1,300 rpm (it's in your Owners Manual).

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Did you ever put a relay on that horn....If not i have a couple laying around so you can have one if you want...
A stock horn w/ a relay will surprise the hell out of you - MUCH louder!

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post #10 of 18 (permalink) Old 07-05-2015, 03:21 PM Thread Starter
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I think that may be it! I put one on my heated grips, but I don't remember getting one for the horn. I assumed there was one on the original oem wiring with Capn Kirks's dual wire connection method (maybe he'll need to edit his pictorial work instructions to include a relay - ?? :-) , so I did not consider adding a relay like I did on my heated grips (and turned up, they cook through Grip Buddies covers too, but are still dialed up a little from before.)

It's just been a mild sedan horn at best lately, and I haven't noticed any cage drivers being startled or defecating/urinating on themselves lately. I kind of miss that when people pull in front of me and are not paying attention to driving

Thanks Guys!



And I'm going to set idle at 1500 rpm just to make sure.

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post #11 of 18 (permalink) Old 07-06-2015, 10:22 AM
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Kawdog,

You might have said and I missed, it.... but what battery are you running, how old is it, and what type/style is it (OEM wet, AGM, Shorai, Deka?)

Sometimes people have high expectations from older batteries of "stock" wet configuration, just curious what your runnin man....

That's some intense readin regarding stators and such... like a pizza and a six pack evening, sober up, have ice cream wait an hour and start drinkin again.

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post #12 of 18 (permalink) Old 07-06-2015, 12:35 PM Thread Starter
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Kawdog,

You might have said and I missed, it.... but what battery are you running, how old is it, and what type/style is it (OEM wet, AGM, Shorai, Deka?)

Sometimes people have high expectations from older batteries of "stock" wet configuration, just curious what your runnin man....

That's some intense readin regarding stators and such... like a pizza and a six pack evening, sober up, have ice cream wait an hour and start drinkin again.

Oem 2012 Vs. model new 4/2014. Maybe sitting up tainted battery. I'll have it checked. MEGABOOST doesn't show any bad cells yet. And a blip on my throttle sends my voltage to the green light OR MEGABOOST on my bike for 30 seconds, so the idle may be part of the charging solution and the horn relay would be the reliable horn solution. Random surveys seem to be in 5 to 7 year range for battery life for rider-owners (i.e. - not sitting,) so my bike may be in question if the battery was sitting for 2 years with acid in it.

When my choke is on, it's idling at 1.5k rpm perfect. Maybe they set it to cold engine?

The Relay solution sounds like the ultimate solution for the horn though: there ain't no horse shoes scoring in horns when you need them on a motorcycle.

Yeah, I've got 2 number one engineering school degrees in the world, and one is a multi-disciplined CIMS certificate graduate program; and I can't get through one sentence, lol. Voltage light meters mounted where I can see it, MEGABOOST charger and battery cell monitor, and rpm's seem like the root cause variables to be concerned with from the evidence. Of course the Japanese could have make an electronic mistake, but statistically, there is no understandable evidence based on objective measures that I could see

Last edited by kawdog; 07-06-2015 at 12:43 PM.
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post #13 of 18 (permalink) Old 07-06-2015, 10:20 PM
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Sounds like you are on the right track- curious what you find. I didn't know your bike was that new, after awhile one thinks that everyone is still flying a gen 1...

Report back on this one.
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post #14 of 18 (permalink) Old 07-14-2015, 01:40 PM Thread Starter
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Since the Megaboost, the voltage has been better with the horn, although I still need to bump my idle up. The idle weekends were draining the battery a little.

Upon suggestion from Amazon product questions, I could get a ctek female/male extension cord and cut the male end off to connect to my SAE cord from Megaboost charger. But instead, I'll just put a SAE charger (battery tender) terminal on my right dash and then move my lighter too (from handlebars to the right side of my dash I'll still have the trick light gage (ye/Gr/Red) lights and 2 types of charger on my dash: plus a lighter to pump air in my tires OR light up a stogie
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post #15 of 18 (permalink) Old 07-14-2015, 02:06 PM
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I'm a little confused by this thread; why are you leaving your bike running at idle for long periods of time?

Every bike I've ever worked on has to be running at over 2,500rpm to produce 13+ volts.

Or are you saying that after sitting for a couple days that your voltage falls below 12.5v and has trouble starting?

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post #16 of 18 (permalink) Old 07-14-2015, 02:18 PM Thread Starter
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I'm a little confused by this thread; why are you leaving your bike running at idle for long periods of time?

Every bike I've ever worked on has to be running at over 2,500rpm to produce 13+ volts.

Or are you saying that after sitting for a couple days that your voltage falls below 12.5v and has trouble starting?
No, the dual horns would not work at low idle after sitting for a couple of days when not reved up over 3k rpm. It had just started doing it after a while of 1k rpm idle for 6 months and no charger: nothing too unexpected with only marginal effects. Just using the MEGABOOST charger has made all the difference in the world already.
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post #17 of 18 (permalink) Old 07-14-2015, 02:37 PM
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Ah gotcha. Thanks for the clarity!

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post #18 of 18 (permalink) Old 07-14-2015, 04:25 PM
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Just ride the bike every day more than 10 miles at a time and you'll have no issues. Don't you live in sunny California with infrequent rain?

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