Denali D2 LED Flicker - Kawasaki Versys Forum
 
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post #1 of 13 (permalink) Old 08-17-2013, 03:24 PM Thread Starter
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Denali D2 LED Flicker

Hi all,

Finally installed my Denalis yesterday as I got the back-ordered brackets a few days ago. Very impressed with the build quality and ease of setup. I hooked them up for the dual feature (low beams on = D2s on at 40%; high beams on = D2s on at 100%). These things are BRIGHT! On the low feature, they definitley add a good amount of light to the sides of the road (when aimed properly) and I'm sure boost my visibility during daytime riding. With the high beams on and the D2s at max power, it's like night and day, no joke. The power consumption very low too. My voltmeter hardly registers a change between them on or off at max power. So while I've been happy all of that, there's one small thing that's been bugging me:

The two LEDs will both flicker in unison about every 5-6 seconds, sometimes intermittently, but always in union. This flicker does not happen at all when the high beams are on and the LEDs are at max power. I rechecked all the connections and followed the instructions for the dual intensity setup precisely. The only thing I changed was that I used a normal butt splice on the switched 12v power source because the included positap didn't work.

Any suggestions for an easy fix before I call up Twisted? Something I'm overlooking maybe? I was suspecting a power/ground issue, but ruled that out mostly because they're perfectly fine with max power.

2012 Kawasaki Versys 650 - 20,500 miles
2000 Volvo V70XC 2.4T - 258,000 miles
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post #2 of 13 (permalink) Old 08-17-2013, 10:49 PM
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Hi Ed,

I had the exact same experience with my D2's. I contacted Twisted and they said that I had "dirty wiring" and there was nothing that could be done. Cleaned everything real well with contact cleaner; no change. Asked for advice on some other sites and it was suggested that installing a resistor could fix it, but I never tried that. At the end of the day I learned to live with the flicker, and it hasn't been a big deal. I still love these lights. The flickering is only on low intensity. But having the D2's at night in the rain is worth every penny that they cost.

Walter
IBA# 55188

2009 Versys
Givi V35 sidecases w/ Admore lights
SW-Motech rear rack
Givi windscreen
First Gear dual heat-troller
Thermo-Bob
Denali D2D LED driving lights
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post #3 of 13 (permalink) Old 08-18-2013, 05:06 AM
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Sometimes I have been wondering if there is something strange with the V:s electrical system/wiring.
I installed a Blaster-X rear LED light some time ago. The two first lights gave up after a short time. The fabricator, who was very interested in the problem and in fixing it, installed a capacitor and after that the third rear light works quite well.
Still though, if I rev the engine very hard at stand still, I sometimes get an erratic flash from the light. It looks like it is restarting and that behaviour doesn't change if I connect it directly to the battery and ground
The manufacturer suspected that there was something creating electrical interference in the system. I cannot think of what that should be... The extras I have put on is LED daylight driving lights, Oxford grip and an extra upper brakelight in the Givi topbox.

Last edited by anders55; 08-18-2013 at 06:36 AM.
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post #4 of 13 (permalink) Old 08-18-2013, 08:10 AM
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Now that I recall, mine flicker a bit on low also. I know we did the wiring well, and that the connections are solid. I've just ignored it. It is bothersome, though.
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post #5 of 13 (permalink) Old 08-18-2013, 09:29 AM Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by walter View Post
I contacted Twisted and they said that I had "dirty wiring" and there was nothing that could be done.

At the end of the day I learned to live with the flicker, and it hasn't been a big deal. I still love these lights. The flickering is only on low intensity. But having the D2's at night in the rain is worth every penny that they cost.
That's a little disappointing. I may call them up and tell them I'm having the same issue. I know my connections to the battery and ground are solid. I did initially have an issue tapping into the headlight wire (which I use for the switched power source) though. I knew this because the lights simply didn't turn on. Once I used a normal butt splice, it worked fine.

Quote:
Originally Posted by anders55 View Post
Sometimes I have been wondering if there is something strange with the V:s electrical system/wiring.
One thing I did notice while tapping into the headlight wire was how cheap the wiring felt. It seems like a decent wire from the outside, good gauge, but when I cut and stripped it to splice, the amount of inside wires are far fewer than you'd imagine for the gauge of the wire. They were also silver (aluminum?) and very easy to bend.

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Originally Posted by HondaGalToo View Post
Now that I recall, mine flicker a bit on low also. I know we did the wiring well, and that the connections are solid. I've just ignored it. It is bothersome, though.
It honestly doesn't bug me that much... built in light modulator? What I am concerned about though is potentially reduced life due to the obvious power fluctuations. That, and they were expensive lights with good reviews, so I expect them to work without problems.

2012 Kawasaki Versys 650 - 20,500 miles
2000 Volvo V70XC 2.4T - 258,000 miles
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post #6 of 13 (permalink) Old 08-18-2013, 10:59 AM
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It is a little disappointing and from some of the advice that I have gotten from people with a much better background in circuits than I have, it may be something that can be easily fixed by Denali / TT / whoever actually makes these things. I've had my setup for at least a year and have progressed from pissed off that $400 worth of hardware didn't work the way it should to just mildly annoyed. Still, the combination of the D2's and an upgraded Sylvania Silverstar main bulb has made all the difference in the world for me with the night riding that I do on unlit roads. And I'm convinced that they make me more conspicuous to cagers.

Walter
IBA# 55188

2009 Versys
Givi V35 sidecases w/ Admore lights
SW-Motech rear rack
Givi windscreen
First Gear dual heat-troller
Thermo-Bob
Denali D2D LED driving lights
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post #7 of 13 (permalink) Old 08-18-2013, 12:56 PM
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I am going to jump in here, even though I have no idea if you have led's or HID's. If the lights are being controlled by a controller for both low and high, a filter capacitor across the lights would reduce the flickering . One test I would suggest is to measure the voltage across the lights on low, using a good digital voltmeter, set on volts ac, the reason for volts ac or( volts root mean square), is you are looking for the AC component of the DC output. You might measure 1 VAC, depending on the wattage ( current ), you would start by adding between 4000 and 8000 mFD @ 50 VDC across the lights, this would even out the ripple / flicker. We are talking $4 in parts.

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post #8 of 13 (permalink) Old 08-18-2013, 02:29 PM
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thanks onewizard....I think that what some of us Denali D2D owners are looking for is "buy part x from Radio Shack and connect it between y and z". Not necessarily because I'm helpless or lazy...I've rebuilt several motors and recently did my 15K valve adjustment without problems (just takes me a little longer). But something about electricity is an unsolvable mystery to me. I even took a night course in circuits to try and remedy the situation, and I almost got thrown out by the instructor because I kept wiring my capacitors in backwards and blowing them up I am still hoping that Twisted Throttle will bring out a fix, because I have heard from so many other users with the exact same problem (and it's not limited to the Versys).

Walter
IBA# 55188

2009 Versys
Givi V35 sidecases w/ Admore lights
SW-Motech rear rack
Givi windscreen
First Gear dual heat-troller
Thermo-Bob
Denali D2D LED driving lights
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post #9 of 13 (permalink) Old 08-18-2013, 02:35 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by onewizard View Post
I am going to jump in here, even though I have no idea if you have led's or HID's. If the lights are being controlled by a controller for both low and high, a filter capacitor across the lights would reduce the flickering . One test I would suggest is to measure the voltage across the lights on low, using a good digital voltmeter, set on volts ac, the reason for volts ac or( volts root mean square), is you are looking for the AC component of the DC output. You might measure 1 VAC, depending on the wattage ( current ), you would start by adding between 4000 and 8000 mFD @ 50 VDC across the lights, this would even out the ripple / flicker. We are talking $4 in parts.

Forgot to mention that I have a HID dip conversion as well, maybe that could cause some interference? I have no idea...
But still, if I hook my LED rear light directly to battery, I get this disturbance.

Anders B.
Sweden
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post #10 of 13 (permalink) Old 08-18-2013, 05:40 PM
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Mine flicker too! Drives me insane
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post #11 of 13 (permalink) Old 08-18-2013, 10:05 PM
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I very much doubt a distributor is going to do anything to correct a manufacturing defect, that only occurs on low setting.
Just went to Twisted Throttle and fully understand what is happening, the low beam is actually PWM, ( pulse width modulated) thus the flicker. Looking at the video, the only place you could correct this flicker is were the lights plug into the harness. The specs say "The D2s only draw 10 watts (0.83 amps at 12 volts DC) of power per lamp, thanks to Prime Drive Technology:"
Looking at this, the only way you could add filter capacitors would be to cut into the harness for each light , just after the modulator, you would need the correct polarity and I would use 2000 mFD @ 50 VDC for each light. If I was the manufacturer, I would house the capacitor in a sealed enclosure with a male and female socket to match the harness that they plug into, any other method would require cutting into the sealed harness, which wouldn't be something I would recommend for the average bike mechanic.

Last edited by onewizard; 08-18-2013 at 10:34 PM.
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post #12 of 13 (permalink) Old 08-19-2013, 04:17 AM
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Being pulse width modulated, it would be an interesting exercise to check the voltage with an oscilloscope and see if what the wave form is.
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post #13 of 13 (permalink) Old 08-19-2013, 06:44 AM
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Being pulse width modulated, it would be an interesting exercise to check the voltage with an oscilloscope and see if what the wave form is.
No kidding, too bad the manufacturer didn't go the extra mile, since Led's show everything.
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