Engine "Hunting" - Kawasaki Versys Forum
 
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post #1 of 14 (permalink) Old 01-28-2009, 12:11 AM Thread Starter
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Engine "Hunting"

Hi guys

I have an '07 w/ 16,000km on it (metric in Oz) that I ahve just purchased.

When it sit on 4000RPM at 60-80km/hr depending on gear, part throttle, I can feel the bike "hunting" a bit. It's damn irritiating.

The original owner has removed the secondary throttle butterflies, and I have done the mod to add the second throttle body tee'd into the MAP sensor. This reduced the problem, but it's still there.

There is no missing, stuttering or any other issue. Runs perfect, just this feel like it's trying to get the fuel map right and switching between maps or something. It's only slight, but irritiating on the straight. Revving past 5500 and the bvehaviour goes away or becomes unoticeable.

I know there is no knock sensor, but there is an Oxygen sensor, so I assume it runs closed loop and retunes?

Any tips appreciated.

Also, mine doesn't have a cat, do the european or yank bikes come with a cat converter? (Assuming it's not buried inside the stock can).

Thanx
Paul
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post #2 of 14 (permalink) Old 01-28-2009, 01:28 AM
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can't speak for the North American market, but EU bikes have a cat.....
I'd be surprised if the North American & Ozzie one don't
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post #3 of 14 (permalink) Old 01-28-2009, 09:15 AM
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http://www.powercommander.com/powerc...b/default.aspx This will fix you right up!

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post #4 of 14 (permalink) Old 01-28-2009, 10:08 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by [email protected] View Post
Hi guys

I have an '07 w/ 16,000km on it (metric in Oz) that I ahve just purchased.

When it sit on 4000RPM at 60-80km/hr depending on gear, part throttle, I can feel the bike "hunting" a bit. It's damn irritiating.

The original owner has removed the secondary throttle butterflies, and I have done the mod to add the second throttle body tee'd into the MAP sensor. This reduced the problem, but it's still there.

There is no missing, stuttering or any other issue. Runs perfect, just this feel like it's trying to get the fuel map right and switching between maps or something. It's only slight, but irritiating on the straight. Revving past 5500 and the bvehaviour goes away or becomes unoticeable.

I know there is no knock sensor, but there is an Oxygen sensor, so I assume it runs closed loop and retunes?

Any tips appreciated.

Also, mine doesn't have a cat, do the european or yank bikes come with a cat converter? (Assuming it's not buried inside the stock can).

Thanx
Paul
I'd recommend checking for any air leaks or fuel restrictions before going forward with anything else. From what you are describing it's lean, as I'm sure you realize. Also, depending on where you are if you are using Ethanol fuel, try another brand and / or different octane. I'm not saying that it needs more octane...but the amount of ethanol varies greatly from brand to brand and octane to octane. We've seen labeled E-10 {10 percent ethanol} with 18 percent......that will make any of our bikes run leaner. Just a thought before you spend money.
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post #5 of 14 (permalink) Old 01-28-2009, 01:10 PM
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They all have cats in the muffler, but only the european version has the oxygen sensor. Don't use a Tee on your IAP sensor hose. Just connect a hose to both TB's, preferably 6" long and 1/8" (3.175 mm) or 3 mm ID. Make sure the IAP hose is on its left (outer) fitting.
Adjusting the TPS up to spec also helped cure the lean induced hunting on mine. Your throttle bodies' vacuum synchronization may be a bit off as well...

Last edited by invader; 02-28-2009 at 01:24 AM.
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post #6 of 14 (permalink) Old 01-28-2009, 03:24 PM
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I think you have an air leak ,make sure that all the intake section is properly sealed,one way to do it is start it let it idle and spray around the intake parts with carb spray,if the idle changes then you have found the leak

AMA EAA STN
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post #7 of 14 (permalink) Old 01-28-2009, 06:23 PM
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Air leak- can you raise the RPM and squirt around with some carb cleaner, see if you can hear it straighten out?
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post #8 of 14 (permalink) Old 01-28-2009, 08:11 PM
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Air leak- can you raise the RPM and squirt around with some carb cleaner, see if you can hear it straighten out?
I've used WD-40 for the "air leak test" with great results, {but be cautioned...most of these canned "lubes / cleaners" are very volitile and are flammable, i.e., be careful!!!}......yes, you'll notice a change in rpm if the leak is present.
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post #9 of 14 (permalink) Old 01-28-2009, 08:35 PM
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From what I remember from my crappy car days, an air leak is more apparent at idle, and gets less noticeable with RPM. I would suspect a throttle body sync might be in order, and maybe a clean air filter.

2007 Versys Black, V35 Bags, H&B Bars, Skidmarx Hugger.Fender Ex., Avon Distanzia, Braided Lines, Hella 65W bulbs Arrow Can, DNA Air filter, GIVI tall screen (for winter), PCIII, Baldwin Saddle. **SOLD**

2011 KTM SM-T. Crash bars, E55 Top Box, Fender extender front and rear.
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post #10 of 14 (permalink) Old 01-29-2009, 04:58 AM
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From what I remember from my crappy car days, an air leak is more apparent at idle, and gets less noticeable with RPM. I would suspect a throttle body sync might be in order, and maybe a clean air filter.
It depends where you are experiencing the "problem". Sometimes at idle discernable differences are hard to notice, and can be picked up easier {to the naked ear} in the problem zone. Agreed with the crappy car days though...memories....
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post #11 of 14 (permalink) Old 01-29-2009, 06:45 AM
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i think you are a little lean. so was my versys. i added a techlusion and it did not seem to help. (it did on the other bike i used it on) what really fixed my bike was adjusting the tps. i adjusted it by feel not with special tools. you can do a search to find out more about it. its already been described better than i could. it cured all the lean running of my bike.
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post #12 of 14 (permalink) Old 01-29-2009, 04:54 PM Thread Starter
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I reckon this is an Oxygen Sensor





Manufactured 07/07 on the compliance plate.

I'll try adjusting the TPS to see what effect it has.

Paul
post #13 of 14 (permalink) Old 01-29-2009, 11:17 PM
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I reckon this is an Oxygen Sensor

It is. In NA we often forget that other markets have a closed loop FI.

Quote:
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I'll try adjusting the TPS to see what effect it has.
If you must, at least mark the original position so you can return to it easily....

The symptoms you described are typical of un-synchronized throttle bodies, as Red Herring mentioned. Check for leaks around the inlet manifold and check the TBS first.

Gustavo

Last edited by Gustavo; 01-29-2009 at 11:47 PM.
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post #14 of 14 (permalink) Old 02-28-2009, 01:29 AM
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My stock TPS setting was a bit low (4.03 V output at max throttle opening with 4.99 V input). Input voltage was within spec, but either 4.76 or 4.99 (spec: 4.75 - 5.25 V), depending when I checked it. TPS sensor input adds fuel and advances ignition timing when opening throttle from a low throttle opening position, and at lower rpm... With engine warmed up then stopped (to let throttle drop to normal idle/minimum opening) and with ignition on, maximum throttle output should be about 4.04 V with 4.76 V input, and maximum throttle output should be about 4.22 V (spec: 4.2 - 4.4 V) if input is near 4.99 V, to have idle position output within spec of 1.005 - 1.035V (I got 1.031 V). Rotate main (bottom) TPS counterclockwise to increase output voltage, and rotate sub-throttle (upper) TPS counterclockwise to reduce fast idle rpm (My STPS is perfect backed off all the way, which isn't far from original position). Start and warm up engine, adjust idle to 1300 rpm, then check main TPS input voltage, check output voltage at idle and maximum throttle opening.

By the way, I meant 6" of 1/8" (3.175 mm) or 3 mm ID hose to couple TB vacuum sync fitting, and not 3/32" ID...

Last edited by invader; 02-28-2009 at 02:25 AM.
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