So as I'm cruising along today, a thought/question occurred to me... - Kawasaki Versys Forum
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post #1 of 20 (permalink) Old 07-07-2017, 12:26 AM Thread Starter
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So as I'm cruising along today, a thought/question occurred to me...

What happens when I hit the starter button while buzzing down the road at 65mph?

To my decidedly unscientific way of thinking 3 things may occur:

a) there's a lockout on the switch/engine to prevent idiots like me from successfully destroying my starter pinion and flywheel.

b) there is no a), I just successfully converted my starter pinion and flywheel teeth into metallic dust.

c) Nothing or maybe something because of some other option I hadn't considered.

Anybody schooled up on this and can answer the burning question of the century?

Last edited by aboyandhisversys; 07-07-2017 at 12:32 AM.
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post #2 of 20 (permalink) Old 07-07-2017, 06:47 AM
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Nothing will happen, the clutch is not pulled in while in gear.
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post #3 of 20 (permalink) Old 07-07-2017, 09:50 AM
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Exactly

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Originally Posted by steve1503 View Post
Nothing will happen, the clutch is not pulled in while in gear.
As Steve said
Since I use my brake light to engage my headlight relay after retrofitting a series regulator, hitting the start relay drops the headlight relay out, provided you don't have the brake engaged, I do this when it is very hot out , the fan is running and I am waiting for a stop light to change to green, with the motor idling, as the fan load + headlight exceeds the output of the stator at idle. I always use the brake before engaging into first gear and this brings on my headlight again. For those that question this, once your bike is started and produces 8 volts or more, the headlight relay latches on, if you stalled the bike, your headlight remains on until you hit start, the start circuit disengages the headlight relay. This is explained in more detail under Polaris regulator install, in How To forum.
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post #4 of 20 (permalink) Old 07-07-2017, 11:49 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by aboyandhisversys View Post
What happens when I hit the starter button while buzzing down the road at 65mph?

To my decidedly unscientific way of thinking 3 things may occur:

a) there's a lockout on the switch/engine to prevent idiots like me from successfully destroying my starter pinion and flywheel.

b) there is no a), I just successfully converted my starter pinion and flywheel teeth into metallic dust.

c) Nothing or maybe something because of some other option I hadn't considered.
Anybody schooled up on this and can answer the burning question of the century?
The easiest, yet potentially most costly, way to find out is - wait for it - try it and see what happens! After all, empirical evidence is far better than another's opinion. But then, that's just my opinion!

Arion

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post #5 of 20 (permalink) Old 07-07-2017, 12:10 PM
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Funny Post

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The easiest, yet potentially most costly, way to find out is - wait for it - try it and see what happens! After all, empirical evidence is far better than another's opinion. But then, that's just my opinion!
I guess you didn't read my post, I hit the start button at idle ( 1350 RPM) to turn my headlight off, now granted, I have never tried hitting my start button at 6000 RPM, usually I have my feet up on the highway pegs if I am at 6K.
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post #6 of 20 (permalink) Old 07-09-2017, 07:13 PM
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The easiest, yet potentially most costly, way to find out is - wait for it - try it and see what happens! After all, empirical evidence is far better than another's opinion. But then, that's just my opinion!
While I CAN'T argue w/ your suggestion, I WILL answer w/ something I learned while getting RCAF wings:

ALWAYS do the SAME number of landings AND takeoffs....

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post #7 of 20 (permalink) Old 07-10-2017, 12:02 AM
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After serving in US Naval Air I can say unless Newton's Law of Gravity has been repealed you will always do the same number of landings as takeoffs. It's where you land that counts.
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post #8 of 20 (permalink) Old 07-10-2017, 02:15 PM
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After serving in US Naval Air I can say unless Newton's Law of Gravity has been repealed you will always do the same number of landings as takeoffs. It's where you land that counts.
I can recall a few 'mid-air' disintegrations that I'm PRETTY SURE would NOT count as landings...



as well as a few "nylon-let-downs" after 'pulling the handles'....


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post #9 of 20 (permalink) Old 07-10-2017, 02:30 PM
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All the pieces parts and parachutists "landed" somewhere, somehow. I stand by Sir Newton... So as not to totally hijack this thread I might add to the OP that his efforts might be better put to maintaining his situational awareness as opposed to ruminating about what would happen if he activated various switches at random times. Nuf sed 'bout dat. Peace, out.

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post #10 of 20 (permalink) Old 07-10-2017, 11:45 PM
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I read all the posts but the question has not been answered-I wondered the same thing back in 1966 when I got my first bike with electric starter-the answer is nothing will happen because even at idle the engine is turning faster than the starter and the starter clutch will not engage- all the Jap bikes are like that- do you think they would make a bike that you could blow up by pushing a button LOL also back in the day when the starter clutch would not catch on early Honda's it made a hell of a noise that Honda called raped turkey-true story
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post #11 of 20 (permalink) Old 07-11-2017, 12:14 AM Thread Starter
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I read all the posts but the question has not been answered-I wondered the same thing back in 1966 when I got my first bike with electric starter-the answer is nothing will happen because even at idle the engine is turning faster than the starter and the starter clutch will not engage- all the Jap bikes are like that- do you think they would make a bike that you could blow up by pushing a button LOL also back in the day when the starter clutch would not catch on early Honda's it made a hell of a noise that Honda called raped turkey-true story
...aaand Motorboy wins the prize I think! stop into the *shop and claim your prize!

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post #12 of 20 (permalink) Old 07-11-2017, 02:01 AM
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yep.... sprague clutch. it's always engaged... the rollers are oval and only "lock up" in one direction.... only happens when the starter turns faster than the crankshaft.

and ya, with stock wiring on the headlight relay, it looks like the HL relay grounds through the start relay... that way when the starter relay energizes it puts the plus on both sides of the HL relay (no path to ground)
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if I'm answering your question I assume the basic points have been addressed, such as: did you do a compression test? is it still on fire?

Last edited by Beezerboy; 07-11-2017 at 02:23 AM.
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post #13 of 20 (permalink) Old 07-11-2017, 03:22 AM
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Nothing happens, tried it on both bikes out of curiosity months ago.
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post #14 of 20 (permalink) Old 07-11-2017, 08:59 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bcalan View Post
All the pieces parts and parachutists "landed" somewhere, somehow. I stand by Sir Newton... So as not to totally hijack this thread I might add to the OP that his efforts might be better put to maintaining his situational awareness as opposed to ruminating about what would happen if he activated various switches at random times. Nuf sed 'bout dat. Peace, out.
As a former USAF crew chief (9 years on F-111s), I just wish you stick actuators would just stop breaking or jumping out of my birds! ;^)

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post #15 of 20 (permalink) Old 07-11-2017, 01:11 PM
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As a former USAF crew chief (9 years on F-111s), I just wish you stick actuators would just stop breaking or jumping out of my birds! ;^)
Ya GOTTA understand that us "stick actuators" would FAR RATHER be in a position to land the 'bird'....



I knew a fellow who "scrambled" in an F-86 in Europe, had an engine failure shortly after reaching 500', pulled the handles, SUCCESSFULLY, then walked back to the airbase carrying his 'chute, but as he did NOT have his wallet w/ ID the MPs were loath to allow him back in....


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Last edited by fasteddiecopeman; 07-11-2017 at 01:14 PM.
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post #16 of 20 (permalink) Old 07-11-2017, 07:55 PM
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I can tell you that Murphy dictates the starter in a Cessna single engine aircraft will not engage in flight after an intentional engine shutdown. It will fail silently immediately after starting the engine on the ground, and thus not work in the air but you won't know that until after you shut down the engine somewhere around 5,000 feet in the air.

It takes nearly red-line airspeed to induce the stopped prop to spin so as to restart the engine. Fortunately one needs somewhat less than 5,000 feet of altitude to dive the aircraft to red line speed.

Cessna starters do work wonderfully after a mechanical fault causes the engine to fail in flight. The starter will spin that engine until the battery melts, but due to the engine fault the engine will not start.

There's a patron saint for young curious pilots. I'm not so sure there is one for curious motorcycle riders.
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post #17 of 20 (permalink) Old 07-22-2017, 04:26 AM
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Cessna 150s had a sprague clutch starter... some of you may remember the pull to engage starter.

if you have a feathering prop and it stops, you need a good starter or a (un)feathering accumulator to get the prop off the feather stops.... no amount of airspeed will move it out of the streamline position

if I'm answering your question I assume the basic points have been addressed, such as: did you do a compression test? is it still on fire?

Last edited by Beezerboy; 07-22-2017 at 01:35 PM.
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post #18 of 20 (permalink) Old 07-22-2017, 08:43 AM
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With a flash from this guy in Australia, my FZ-09 could have cruise control holding down the starter button
Cruise Control | Tuneboy
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post #19 of 20 (permalink) Old 07-22-2017, 08:33 PM
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Quote:
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Cessna 150s had a sprague clutch starter... some of you may remember the pull to engage starter.

if you have a feathering prop and it stops, you need a good starter or a (un)feathering accumulator to get the prop off the feather stops.... no amount of airspeed will move it out of the streamline position
I owned a 1958 Cessna 175 for a few years. It had the pull handle in the dashboard to engage the starter. It mechanically moved the starter shaft to engage the ring gear. No question it would engage when you wanted it to. That engine had an updraft carburetor mounted underneath the engine which would leak gas when primed, resulting in a front tire fire if the exhaust sent a spark in that direction. You had to learn all the quirks of those old airplanes.
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post #20 of 20 (permalink) Old 07-22-2017, 10:59 PM
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ya the O-300 (C145) in the early 172s had a single point primer straight into the manifold, just above the carb. most of the Continental C and A series engines had the same setup. most had ports behind the intake valves to do individual primer nozzles, but the factory just plugged them. multi point is what I did to mine & used the old primer port to read manifold pressure.... quite a boon in detecting carb ice, which was common on those engines.

if I'm answering your question I assume the basic points have been addressed, such as: did you do a compression test? is it still on fire?
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