Stuck Crank - Kawasaki Versys Forum
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post #1 of 17 (permalink) Old 02-14-2016, 10:37 AM Thread Starter
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Stuck Crank

Hi,
I've got a question if anyone can please assist. I have a 09 Versys 650 with 25k miles. I replaced the battery, starter and starter relay thinking that was the original issue because it wouldn't turn over. The stater relay was still clicking, so I removed the crank access cover and tried to turn it (clockwise) and it's actually stuck hard(in neutral). I can counter clock it for about 3/4 revolution and it gets stuck..go back clockwise 3/4 and it "clunks" and gets stuck. Any clue to what this may be? broken timing chain? What is the best approach?
Thank you for any help!
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post #2 of 17 (permalink) Old 02-14-2016, 11:22 AM
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Can't tell where you are in the world. Did the temperature drop suddenly between the last time it cranked and now?

I've had this happen to me on a generator and after complete dis-assembly we found that the carbon buildup on the head dropped into the cylinder like a hockey puck when the cylinder head got colder than the cylinder body (aluminum/steel shrink/expand at different rates). The carbon got into the ring lands and basically froze the engine.

We pulled the head to fix the problem, but I imagine some creativity with compressed air and an empty spark plug hole might have saved us some grief.

Good luck, I hope it's not as tragic as my case. A rental borescope maybe?

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post #3 of 17 (permalink) Old 02-14-2016, 11:45 AM
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id pull the valve cover off and check the timing chain and valves

yes im a guy.
Silvie=latin for. Of the forest /woods. Fox= Vulpine (also my middle name)

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post #4 of 17 (permalink) Old 02-14-2016, 11:56 AM
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Best way to evaluate freedom of movement is to remove the spark plugs in order to remove engine compression from the equation. With plugs in, and manually rotating the crank, perception and facts are skewed. Going backwards (with crank rotation) isn't usually a good thing.

Quote:
Originally Posted by 09versys View Post
Hi,
I've got a question if anyone can please assist. I have a 09 Versys 650 with 25k miles. I replaced the battery, starter and starter relay thinking that was the original issue because it wouldn't turn over. The stater relay was still clicking, so I removed the crank access cover and tried to turn it (clockwise) and it's actually stuck hard(in neutral). I can counter clock it for about 3/4 revolution and it gets stuck..go back clockwise 3/4 and it "clunks" and gets stuck. Any clue to what this may be? broken timing chain? What is the best approach?
Thank you for any help!
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post #5 of 17 (permalink) Old 02-14-2016, 07:19 PM
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What's the history on it? Have you had it since new? Was it maintained and/or abused? How was it running before, and what happened after?
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post #6 of 17 (permalink) Old 02-14-2016, 08:31 PM Thread Starter
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I don't the history of the bike. I bought it like this from the original owner, he said he's maintained regular service. He was riding it on the freeway going home and the bike suddenly shut off and he had to push it all the way back home. He's not a mechanic so he has no idea what is wrong with the bike.
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post #7 of 17 (permalink) Old 02-14-2016, 08:51 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 09versys View Post
I don't the history of the bike. I bought it like this from the original owner, he said he's maintained regular service. He was riding it on the freeway going home and the bike suddenly shut off and he had to push it all the way back home. He's not a mechanic so he has no idea what is wrong with the bike.
Call me skeptical, but that sounds like a risky buy based on an unlikely story. Good luck.

'IF' he maintained regular service, his mechanic/shop would be the first logical place he would go to find out what is wrong.
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Last edited by kawdog; 02-14-2016 at 08:56 PM.
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post #8 of 17 (permalink) Old 02-14-2016, 09:45 PM
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sounds like it has skipped a tooth and out of timing and dropped a valve if you are hearing a clunk. There should be no clunk!
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post #9 of 17 (permalink) Old 02-14-2016, 11:30 PM Thread Starter
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OK, Thank you. I'll start to take the valve cover off and see what I can find out that's making it stuck. I may begin the process of removing the engine out of the frame if I can't find anything with the motor mounted. I will have to assess if it's worth shipping a motor for a swap or rebuilding this one. Does a 650r ninja motor swap right into the versys? I saw some earlier posting about heads&cams swap as the versys have lower compression, but no mention of the actual 650R motor just being a plug and play. I might have a better chance finding the 650R donor than a versys since I'm on Hawaii. thank you
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post #10 of 17 (permalink) Old 02-14-2016, 11:53 PM
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Same motor, might be some minor wiring differences but physically it should fit.
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post #11 of 17 (permalink) Old 02-15-2016, 12:48 AM
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ninja650 motor will fit - known a a cop motor - because it has HO compared to V650
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post #12 of 17 (permalink) Old 02-15-2016, 01:55 AM
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ninja650 motor will fit - known a a cop motor - because it has HO compared to V650
Yep, all at higher revs.
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post #13 of 17 (permalink) Old 02-15-2016, 02:39 AM
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With the valve cover removed, you might be able to see if a valve remained open or dropped with a visible space between camshaft lobe and lifter... There may then be more damage seen once head is removed.

Ninja 650R/ER-6 'cop motor' engine is a direct swap, as JDRocks will attest... It will fit and run with your stock ECU, throttle bodies, cooling system, exhaust, etc.
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post #14 of 17 (permalink) Old 02-15-2016, 12:45 PM
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...It will fit and run with your stock ECU, throttle bodies...
don't think so, but i admit i've never tried. i always run the OEM ER6F ECUs specific to the model year and swap 100% complete motors, including TBs.

as far as the motor in question, too bad there's not more info. these motors are very durable and can take a lot of abuse without failure. before digging into the motor, i'd like to see the oil drained and inspected for metal. if something let loose, there should be an indicator. if no metal, my thinking might change direction. i'd also like to know if the transmission can be shifted in and out of gear. third, i'd like to know if there is any indication that either left or right side engine covers have been removed in the past.

as far as the previous owner's statements, from experience i wouldn't believe a single word.
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post #15 of 17 (permalink) Old 02-15-2016, 12:53 PM
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Yep, all at higher revs.
you can get places PDQ without bouncing redline, the HP and torque is just plain there if ya want it. few riders would turn it down if available.
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post #16 of 17 (permalink) Old 02-15-2016, 10:08 PM Thread Starter
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I had to time pull the valve cover off and everything looks clean the timing chain looked intact clean..however as suggested I pulled the plugs the left side came out no prob, but the right side was extremely tough..I went slowly and finally got it out and the bottom of the plug was smashed. Bad news and bad buy..looks like maybe a rod bearing failure that caused the piston to hit and maybe the bearing is stuck causing the stuck crank..or as another suggested maybe the bent valve from timing skip. either way looks like I'll have remove and tear into it to see what made it stuck. If I want to get it running quickly a donor motor will be the best bet, but shipping to Hawaii is not going to be cheap. I can sit on the bike hoping to find a local donor, but who knows. I think it's a combination of this bike coming to Hawaii having weather shock, military owner had in a cold temp and brought to Hawaii with a combination of poor maintenance. I agree with another user that posted that these are pretty bullet proof motors if properly maintained I've had 2 08 ninja 650R and both motors were great..decisions...
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post #17 of 17 (permalink) Old 02-15-2016, 10:19 PM
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Maybe a valve (usually stuck open or dropped, and not from timing skip) and/or maybe a broken piston/rod bearing failure as I've also seen. Right side is colder running... Can you see if the cam lobes are all close to their respecting lifter?

Last edited by invader; 02-15-2016 at 10:24 PM.
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