gen 3: Are you tired of people telling you a headlight is out? - Page 3 - Kawasaki Versys Forum
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post #41 of 49 (permalink) Old 01-14-2019, 01:52 AM
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water landings might be ok if the gear is up. our water is about 40F degrees though...

as for the headlight thing, ya, I've people tell me I have one out. I tell 'em.... bite me

if I'm answering your question I assume the basic points have been addressed, such as: did you do a compression test? is it still on fire?
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post #42 of 49 (permalink) Old 01-14-2019, 04:41 AM
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as for the headlight thing, ya, I've people tell me I have one out. I tell 'em.... bite me
Why act so mean about it?
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post #43 of 49 (permalink) Old 01-14-2019, 10:52 AM
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...Until him the record of successful ditchings of jet aircraft is pretty poor....
I beg to differ. The ones we've seen on the News on TV, were CRASHES, not ditchings.

Back in the late 60's, early 70's, a USAF C-133 ditched in the Pacific enroute to 'Nam (I KNOW that it had props). EVERY one was found and saved, but several weeks later the USN was sent to shell it so it would sink, as it had become a hazard to navigation.

Forced landings on 'terra firma'?

Highways sound PDG UNTIL you remember vehicular traffic, AND telephone poles on each side which WILL remove your wings...!

Fields - I already mentioned the fact that they are SELDOM level. Back in the EARLY '60s an RCAF C-130B had to do a forced landing in a field just N of RCAF Stn Trenton (ALL of Lake Ontario is a few miles S!), and it was destroyed when it hit a stone fence (pretty sure it killed everyone on board!).

ANOTHER "B Model" had the latch mechanisms on the outward opening cargo-door just forward of the left wing-root FAIL near Borden, SK, at 'altitude'. The door failure caused an explosive-decompression, the door rotating OUT and UP so hard that it hit #2 engine, then broke the back of the aircraft as it continued OVER, hitting #3 which exploded taking out #4. From cruising on FOUR engines to LOSING three AND the pressurization in seconds will tend to really focus your attention. Meanwhile, when the door took out the top of the fuselage, it ALSO took out the engine controls, but luckily NOT the flight controls, so that C-130 had ONE engine stuck at cruise power, w/ the rest gone.

LUCKILY they were over mid-Saskatchewan which is mostly grain-farming, so the captain was able to force-land in a plowed field, the airplane doing a slow right-hand CW turn as the rudder authority was lost, #1 STILL AT FULL CRUISE POWER because of the loss of the engine controls wouldn't allow them to shut it down.

They exited (RAN LIKE HELL!) from the airplane to a safe distance until it ran out of fuel, stopping #1. VERY lucky.

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post #44 of 49 (permalink) Old 01-14-2019, 10:59 AM
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those two C-130B crashes...

Just looked up info on those two crashes. The one at Trenton was on 27 Apr '67, while the Borden one happened 15 Apr '66. Here's a link IF anyone's interested:

C-130 Accidents & Mishaps for the Royal Canadian Air Force

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post #45 of 49 (permalink) Old 01-14-2019, 11:17 AM
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I beg to differ. The ones we've seen on the News on TV, were CRASHES, not ditchings.

Back in the late 60's, early 70's, a USAF C-133 ditched in the Pacific enroute to 'Nam (I KNOW that it had props). EVERY one was found and saved, but several weeks later the USN was sent to shell it so it would sink, as it had become a hazard to navigation.

Forced landings on 'terra firma'?

Highways sound PDG UNTIL you remember vehicular traffic, AND telephone poles on each side which WILL remove your wings...!

Fields - I already mentioned the fact that they are SELDOM level. Back in the EARLY '60s an RCAF C-130B had to do a forced landing in a field just N of RCAF Stn Trenton (ALL of Lake Ontario is a few miles S!), and it was destroyed when it hit a stone fence (pretty sure it killed everyone on board!).

ANOTHER "B Model" had the latch mechanisms on the outward opening cargo-door just forward of the left wing-root FAIL near Borden, SK, at 'altitude'. The door failure caused an explosive-decompression, the door rotating OUT and UP so hard that it hit #2 engine, then broke the back of the aircraft as it continued OVER, hitting #3 which exploded taking out #4. From cruising on FOUR engines to LOSING three AND the pressurization in seconds will tend to really focus your attention. Meanwhile, when the door took out the top of the fuselage, it ALSO took out the engine controls, but luckily NOT the flight controls, so that C-130 had ONE engine stuck at cruise power, w/ the rest gone.

LUCKILY they were over mid-Saskatchewan which is mostly grain-farming, so the captain was able to force-land in a plowed field, the airplane doing a slow right-hand CW turn as the rudder authority was lost, #1 STILL AT FULL CRUISE POWER because of the loss of the engine controls wouldn't allow them to shut it down.

They exited (RAN LIKE HELL!) from the airplane to a safe distance until it ran out of fuel, stopping #1. VERY lucky.
Herkies are not fun to fly in IMO (from a passenger standpoint) and I certainly wouldn't have wanted to be onboard either of those.
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post #46 of 49 (permalink) Old 01-14-2019, 12:58 PM
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I'd rather put my current aircraft down on a farm field in Kansas than in the ocean off the coast of Mexico. Water offers lots of threats after coming to a stop which terra firma does not. If the choice is mountains vs a lake, or Sully's choice of urban buildings vs calm river then my choice is different. But for sure if I'm going down near the Kansas City airport I will be choosing one of the farms rather than the river there.
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post #47 of 49 (permalink) Old 01-14-2019, 03:17 PM
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ANOTHER "B Model" had the latch mechanisms on the outward opening cargo-door just forward of the left wing-root FAIL near Borden, SK, at 'altitude'. The door failure caused an explosive-decompression, the door rotating OUT and UP so hard that it hit #2 engine, then broke the back of the aircraft as it continued OVER, hitting #3 which exploded taking out #4. From cruising on FOUR engines to LOSING three AND the pressurization in seconds will tend to really focus your attention. Meanwhile, when the door took out the top of the fuselage, it ALSO took out the engine controls, but luckily NOT the flight controls, so that C-130 had ONE engine stuck at cruise power, w/ the rest gone.

LUCKILY they were over mid-Saskatchewan which is mostly grain-farming, so the captain was able to force-land in a plowed field, the airplane doing a slow right-hand CW turn as the rudder authority was lost, #1 STILL AT FULL CRUISE POWER because of the loss of the engine controls wouldn't allow them to shut it down.

They exited (RAN LIKE HELL!) from the airplane to a safe distance until it ran out of fuel, stopping #1. VERY lucky.
Holy Cow!

A big round of applause for the crew on that one. They should have all gotten medals for superior airmanship with their pants full of...well you know what.

Man what a story.

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post #48 of 49 (permalink) Old 01-15-2019, 01:34 PM
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Holy Cow!

A big round of applause for the crew on that one. They should have all gotten medals for superior airmanship with their pants full of...well you know what.

Man what a story.
Here's a FEW little extras:

the loadmaster (notorious for NOT wearing a seat-belt during flight) had just walked past the door, seated himself and fastened his seat-belt when the door 'cut-loose'!

the flight engineer grabbed his oxygen mask and put it on, then passed out as the oxygen system was ripped-out TOO.

the wall at the rear of the cockpit is called the "245 bulkhead", and during the descent the joint at the top kept opening and closing (I'm sure that IF they'd hit turbulence the front of the Herc would have separated killing everyone!) and which would've scared the sh*t outta ME!

the captain briefed that they would try to feather #1 as they 'flared' for the landing ONLY TO DISCOVER THAT THOSE CONTROLS WERE GONE, TOO! which is WHY they ran like hell when it finally "circled" to a stop, then watched as it ran itself out of fuel....

The RCAF sent a Mobile Repair Party [MRP] to try to ready it for transport (to be repaired...?), only to discover that it was a TOTAL WRITE-OFF, and there is (USED to be?) a motel and bar on the S side of the highway (the Yellowhead Hwy, #16) in Borden where they stayed during their work, and there was (is?) a VERY large pic of that Hercules AND the MRP, signed by all of them, on the wall above the bar. I stopped to see it back when I was in training at CFB Moose Jaw, flying jets.

Some years later the SAME captain was flying a C-130E from Bardufoss, Norway back to Canada, when they had a propeller malfunction, were NOT able to 'feather' it, so had to reduce to minimum controllable airspeed (I seem to remember that was 130 knots...) and JUST made it to a suitable airport because of the HUGE increase in fuel-burn.


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post #49 of 49 (permalink) Old 01-15-2019, 01:53 PM
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actually, water landings are fine by me...
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if I'm answering your question I assume the basic points have been addressed, such as: did you do a compression test? is it still on fire?

Last edited by Beezerboy; 01-15-2019 at 02:05 PM.
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