Chain/driveline noise

[fasteddiecopeman]

Originally Posted by Mursili

I actually thought about what you would say about this. It does not seem that too many people get the same life from their chains and sprockets that you do. That being said, you do say that you are on your second front sprocket and if I do the math 38000/2 = 19000 miles and that is quite close to the point I changed my front sprockets. (Of course, I do not know at exactly what point you changed your front sprocket.) The fact that I also changed my chain and rear sprocket at 18000+ miles is more a matter of temperament than necessity.

Changed the front sprocket at 29,642 miles (on 05 Dec 2011). It was in pretty good condition with the teeth just STARTING to hook slightly. Sorry I didn't take a picture of it....

Reversed the rear when I changed out the ContiMotion for a Tourance.

[Sprocket]

I used a cheap electric impact gun to loosen mine and it was a piece of cake. The other option is to put a piece of pipe on the end of the ratchet handle.

[samill2]

Just ordered F/R sprockets and chain from sprocketcenter. I'm sticking with stock 15/46 since this is my first time swapping sprockets and I want to make sure I know how it's supposed to drive on a stock, known-good configuration before I start messing around with different gearing.

I have a long breaker and some cheater pipe ready for that front nut.

Another question: I've never heard of rotating the sprocket...is that something a lot of people do or is it just for those of us who are...let's say...frugal?

[Mursili]

Originally Posted by samill2

JAnother question: I've never heard of rotating the sprocket...is that something a lot of people do or is it just for those of us who are...let's say...frugal?

The only people I have ever heard of doing it (given my limited experience) is fasteddiecopeman and the guy at watt-man who makes Thermo-Bobs. They seem to be knowledgeable fellows. Still, I figured that a new front sprocket is not really splurging on the bike. Then again, I pull perfectly good looking plugs out every 7500 miles and put in new ones because the book says to.

[fasteddiecopeman]

Originally Posted by samill2

...Another question: I've never heard of rotating the sprocket...is that something a lot of people do or is it just for those of us who are...let's say...frugal?

Originally Posted by Mursili

The only people I have ever heard of doing it (given my limited experience) is fasteddiecopeman and the guy at watt-man who makes Thermo-Bobs. They seem to be knowledgeable fellows. Still, I figured that a new front sprocket is not really splurging on the bike. Then again, I pull perfectly good looking plugs out every 7500 miles and put in new ones because the book says to.

Bill and I ONLY rotate the REAR sprocket - we remove, replace, then CHUCK the old front sprocket!

Guess we MIGHT be frugal, but, on the other hand, we BOTH get exceptional mileage from our chains and sprockets....

Don't forget that your "OWNERS MANUAL" gives a wear limit on the chain, and it is 323 mm (12.7") over 20 'pins' and details how to go about measuring it. Both Bill and I lube our chains (with WD40...) more often then the average rider does with whatever he uses.

[Sprocket]

The front sprocket is directional. Don't see any issues with rotating the rear sprocket but it will only help if the wear on it is directional.

[fasteddiecopeman]

Originally Posted by Sprocket

The front sprocket is directional. Don't see any issues with rotating the rear sprocket but it will only help if the wear on it is directional.

...which it WILL be...! (UNLESS your V has a reverse gear.)

[David RSparky3]

After trashing a chain, I found 1" slack to be not enough for me.

I adjusted the chain by the book. Set my suspension to lightest and had a fat ass sit on the bike. Chain was too tight.

Now I set the slack to 1.4" and adjust the rear wheel so the chain wonders back and forth on the sprocket with the wheel in the air.

Set YOUR bike as you wish.

RED 11 V, 12,000 miles.

David

[Sprocket]

Originally Posted by David RSparky3

After trashing a chain, I found 1" slack to be not enough for me.

I adjusted the chain by the book. Set my suspension to lightest and had a fat ass sit on the bike. Chain was too tight.

Now I set the slack to 1.4" and adjust the rear wheel so the chain wonders back and forth on the sprocket with the wheel in the air.

Set YOUR bike as you wish.

RED 11 V, 12,000 miles.

David

Service manual page 2-8. Drive chain slack recommendations are 1 to 1.4inches or 2.5 to 3.5cm measured mid point between front and rear, between a full pull downward and full pull upward.

[David RSparky3]

Originally Posted by David RSparky3

After trashing a chain, I found 1" slack to be not enough for me.

I adjusted the chain by the book. Set my suspension to lightest and had a fat ass sit on the bike. Chain was too tight.

Now I set the slack to 1.4" and adjust the rear wheel so the chain wonders back and forth on the sprocket with the wheel in the air.

Set YOUR bike as you wish.

RED 11 V, 12,000 miles.

David

Originally Posted by Sprocket

Service manual page 2-8. Drive chain slack recommendations are 1 to 1.4inches or 2.5 to 3.5cm measured mid point between front and rear, between a full pull downward and full pull upward.

Try what I did. See if its the same for your bike. 1" slack is not enough for me, maybe you its fine.

[samill2]

I know the thread has kind of veered off but...

I finally got around to this last night. I replaced f/r sprockets with stock sizes and a new RK chain from sprocketcenter.com on recommendation from user twowheels. It was a great choice, btw - I highly recommend them.

I broke the 3.8mm pin due to stupid but was able to use the smaller pin to break the chain.

From what I can tell from a few minutes testing in the sub-freezing weather last night, noise appears to be gone, shifting seems more crisp, etc. Feels great.

I appreciate the help from everyone. Good bunch of guys here.

edit: I also set the chain at about 1.4 and plan to watch it carefully for a few weeks (if I'm able to ride much) to find the right slack for my heft.

[fasteddiecopeman]

Your chain will be at its TIGHTEST when the rear axle, swingarm pivot bolt and countershaft are DIRECTLY in line. The 1 to 1.4" slack is the amount you'll be able to measure when your V is on its stand and the three shafts are NOT in line, with a "little extra" thrown in by Ma Kawasaki, for good effect, so it does NOT get overtight as the suspension runs thru its 'cycle' as you ride.

Your weight does NOT effect that at all, EXCEPT to change how much slack the chain has when you sit on it, and THAT is why it is specified that you check chain-slack when the bike is on its stand, not with someone on it.

[samill2]

Makes sense. I was only connecting the weight to the amount of suspension sag in the first place but, now that I'm thinking about it, it's probably a null point if ones suspension is set correctly to ones weight, right?

[kiwitourer]

Originally Posted by fasteddiecopeman

Bill and I ONLY rotate the REAR sprocket - we remove, replace, then CHUCK the old front sprocket!

Guess we MIGHT be frugal, but, on the other hand, we BOTH get exceptional mileage from our chains and sprockets....

Don't forget that your "OWNERS MANUAL" gives a wear limit on the chain, and it is 323 mm (12.7") over 20 'pins' and details how to go about measuring it. Both Bill and I lube our chains (with WD40...) more often then the average rider does with whatever he uses.

A general rule is, a worn chain will ruin a new sprocket, a new chain will "reconfigure" the teeth of a hooked sprocket. I was told this over 40 years ago and in my experience has worked.

[fasteddiecopeman]

Originally Posted by samill2

Makes sense. I was only connecting the weight to the amount of suspension sag in the first place but, now that I'm thinking about it, it's probably a null point if ones suspension is set correctly to ones weight, right?

"Sag" has EVERYTHING to do with suspension, and NOTHING to do with chain slack!

[samill2]

Originally Posted by fasteddiecopeman

"Sag" has EVERYTHING to do with suspension, and NOTHING to do with chain slack!

So, if suspension flex changes the chain tightness, and rider weight affect suspension flex, how does suspension sag not affect the chain slack? Help me understand.

[BLACK DOG]

Originally Posted by samill2

So, if suspension flex changes the chain tightness, and rider weight affect suspension flex, how does suspension sag not affect the chain slack? Help me understand.

I'm probaly off kilter because I'm 20 miles from my bike...but.
I THINK that the chain is at the tightest point of the swing arm travel cycle when on the stand
(relative the the three cls involved) so that when the arm goes above or below that point the slack would increase slightly rather than get tighter.
Just my guess based on a failing memory set

steve

[samill2]

Originally Posted by BLACK DOG

I'm probaly off kilter because I'm 20 miles from my bike...but.
I THINK that the chain is at the tightest point of the swing arm travel cycle when on the stand
(relative the the three cls involved) so that when the arm goes above or below that point the slack would increase slightly rather than get tighter.
Just my guess based on a failing memory set

steve

If this is accurate, then I think I understand.

[invader]

Rear suspension would have to be compressed by about 3" as measured at rear axle, from its fully extended position. Maybe with spring preload backed off and with heavy guy sitting on passenger seat... Rear suspension should be unladen and completely extended (not compressed) for accurate chain tension measurements under consistent conditions... Adjusting chain tension within specs with rear suspension compressed will result in excessive slack.

Check chain tension at its tightest position. Find tightest position by rotating rear wheel. Measure and adjust chain tension with rear suspension fully extended.

[BLACK DOG]

Originally Posted by samill2

If this is accurate, then I think I understand.

had a few minutes to play with the auto cad & this seems to be true