Fork revalve - Page 3 - Kawasaki Versys Forum
Technical Discussion Topics related to Technical Issues

 1Likes
Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Display Modes
post #41 of 84 (permalink) Old 02-24-2011, 11:55 PM Thread Starter
Member
 
tomla's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2008
Location: oakland
Posts: 575
I finally switched over to 10w belray and added another 10mm to the oil level, now at 115mm L, 125mm R. There's just enough feel and the thing soaks bumps all day. Good luck on your DIY valving, UAV. Phoneman's got you covered.
tomla is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #42 of 84 (permalink) Old 02-25-2011, 11:44 AM
Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: Long Beach, CA
Posts: 73
Gentlemen, we have created a monster:



I'm leaning towards the [17 16 15 13] stack, if for no other reason than that it follows the Fibonacci sequence.

I also like the more linear taper of the [17 16 14 12] stack.

My goals are a big improvement in high speed compliance but maintaining good bottoming resistance at low speeds.

Any thoughts?
UAV online is offline  
post #43 of 84 (permalink) Old 02-25-2011, 02:21 PM
Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Texas
Posts: 137
Fibonacci and Powerpoint do not a good ride make... not that what you've enumerated is fibonacci.

Oil height (air gap) and oil viscosity are the #1 factors in bottoming.

Iteration and copious notes are the key to improving just about everything.

Establishing a baseline from which to compare gathered data is important. Brand/Oil Viscosity was always my starting point. If your oil isn't consistent, valving changes won't be predictable.

Hypothetical drafting on the computer is cheap compared to tearing down the front end of the bike. So I understand your wanting to get as much input as possible before doing the physical part. However, it might be worth your while to lower the oil height in the forks and note what difference that makes. It might help you ball park other proposed changes and its fairly easy to suck the oil out with out dismantling the forks.

Once again good luck!
Phoneman064 is offline  
 
post #44 of 84 (permalink) Old 02-26-2011, 06:09 PM Thread Starter
Member
 
tomla's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2008
Location: oakland
Posts: 575
UAV, you seem like the kind of person that could appreciate this..
http://shimrestackor.com/index.htm
tomla is offline  
post #45 of 84 (permalink) Old 03-03-2011, 12:16 PM
Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: Buffalo, NY
Posts: 22
I have been following this thread for a while and am going to tear into my forks next week hopefully. I plan on a slightly stiffer set up than tomla. sticking with belray 10wt at stock oil height in both forks.

17x.15 (2)
16x.1
15x.1
14x.1
14x.15

I am hoping for a similiar normal ride with the harshness taken out of the initial sharp jolts. I have enough shims to play around a little if i have to. I only went as low as 14mm though so I am limited as to how I can configure the stack.

Unfortunately It is dam cold up here in Buffalo so my first impression ride may not be for a little while, good thing is with all the pot holes I'll know right off the bat if I got it right.
russo is offline  
post #46 of 84 (permalink) Old 03-17-2011, 02:38 PM
Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: Buffalo, NY
Posts: 22
I just got back from my first ride and have to say WOW what a difference revalveing makes, it really transforms this bike. I also chamfered the end of the springs to prevent binding as noted in another suspension mod thread which really helps the back as well.
I am 185 before any gear

front is 2 turns in preload, 40mm sag,
rebound 1/2 turn out full stiff,
oil height left 65mm, right 75mm, belray 10wt.
compression stack is
17x.15 (2)
16x.1
15x.1
14x.1
14x.15

rear is set to 3 setting frmm full soft, 45mm sag
rebound 12 clicks out from full stiff.

My impressions, front does bounce a little at lower speeds below 35-40, (might lower my oil height to stock level, somehow i got screwed up on heights, most likely why my rebound is so tight). Above those speeds extremely compliant and good feel, harness is almost completely gone out of most sharp bumps, large bumps can be felt but not the bone jarring feel like before. Once i lower my oil height ill get a better feel for if the bouncing is related to my minimal air gap, will likely drop it a little at a time as i have 15 mm difference to make up.

Felt great to ride the bike, it is really transformed. If you have not revalved the fork please do so it is 10 times better than stock even with the slight bouncing.

If you live in the buffalo,NY area I will gladly help you do this mod, i have all the correct tools and it really only takes a little over an hour if you only do the right fork.

Last edited by russo; 03-17-2011 at 02:43 PM.
russo is offline  
post #47 of 84 (permalink) Old 03-17-2011, 10:25 PM Thread Starter
Member
 
tomla's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2008
Location: oakland
Posts: 575
So now that you took the blue pill and did the front, what are you going to do about the rear? The R1 shock thread is getting to be an interesting read, no?
tomla is offline  
post #48 of 84 (permalink) Old 03-18-2011, 04:28 AM
Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: Buffalo, NY
Posts: 22
I bought a Cbr600 rear shock that has a 13kg/mm spring rate and is 290mm eye to eye, so it should lower the bike about 1". I just need to make some bushings for the bolts. Right now very happy, we have a break in the weather so I will enjoy the bike for now and swap it when the weather turns bad again.
russo is offline  
post #49 of 84 (permalink) Old 06-10-2011, 02:31 PM
Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: Wales, UK
Posts: 34
Hi Guys,
Fairly new to this forum but had my V since Christmas here in Wales (UK).

Need some help.

Have just taken the right fork apart with the aim of changing the valving, have got the cartridge out OK but cannot see how to remove the valve at the bottom of the carfidge to get to the shims.

Any help much appreciated.

Bart
Bart is offline  
post #50 of 84 (permalink) Old 06-10-2011, 02:42 PM
Member
 
BAMF's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2011
Location: Denver co
Posts: 762
mine seems to dive a lot, so I am thinking of going to 15wt oil and backing off the preload (currently 2 turns in from "stiff")
Do you guys think that with 15wt the fork will still retain high speed tracking?

1997 KLR 650
2011 Halle-friggin-leuya Versys
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
BAMF is offline  
post #51 of 84 (permalink) Old 06-10-2011, 03:21 PM
Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: Long Beach, CA
Posts: 73
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bart View Post
Hi Guys,
Fairly new to this forum but had my V since Christmas here in Wales (UK).

Need some help.

Have just taken the right fork apart with the aim of changing the valving, have got the cartridge out OK but cannot see how to remove the valve at the bottom of the carfidge to get to the shims.

Any help much appreciated.

Bart
Push the compression valve into the cartridge a little bit. This will expose the circlip that keeps the valve from coming out. Carefully remove that circlip and you should be able to push the valve out with the rod.

...

And be sure to note how the valve and shims come apart so you can put it back together the right way. Pictures would be a good idea.

...

Also, take a close look at the copper crush washer that seals the hole in the bottom of the fork... mine got boogered in my first revalve. If you have time it would be a good idea to replace it.

Last edited by UAV online; 06-10-2011 at 03:28 PM.
UAV online is offline  
post #52 of 84 (permalink) Old 06-10-2011, 03:45 PM
Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: Wales, UK
Posts: 34
Don't you just love the interweb sometimes, that worked a treat.

Am just about to take some pictures too.

UAV

Bart
Bart is offline  
post #53 of 84 (permalink) Old 06-14-2011, 05:53 PM
Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: Wales, UK
Posts: 34
Just got back from my first test ride with my revalved forks and what a improvment.

I am 74kg in my birthday suit and went with
17x.15
16x-15
15x.15
14x.15
10w oil in right leg
15w in left ( I had some lying around)
100mm and 90mm air gap

Thanks to everyone for posting their setups and help.

Now for the R1 shock I think.

Bart
Bart is offline  
post #54 of 84 (permalink) Old 06-15-2011, 03:47 PM
Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: NJ and WV
Posts: 603
Phoneman, Tomla
I just replaced the rear spring with a Hyperpro progressive spring, which also lowers the bike about quarter inch (without rider). After riding about a hundred miles, I definitely am pleased with the improved ride. After reading all this, I'd like to replace the stock fork springs with Hyperpro progressive fork-springs, which also lower the bike a bit more.

I was thinking I'd first try the new springs, then change the shims as tried by one of you. Does anyone have recent experience to suggest for the revalving? I'm about 200# with all my gear.
ScottyNeal is offline  
post #55 of 84 (permalink) Old 06-15-2011, 05:24 PM
Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: Long Beach, CA
Posts: 73
Glad it all worked out.

Kinda fun, isn't it?
UAV online is offline  
post #56 of 84 (permalink) Old 06-16-2011, 12:49 PM
Member
 
mminob's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2008
Location: San Diego,California
Posts: 171
Fork Seal Stiction...

I would love to reduce or eliminate the fork seal drag or stiction I am feeling on my 09 15,000 mile Versys...I changed to Maxima 10wt and noticed quite a bit of seal stick and small bump harshness...Are all seals the same quality? Are all fork oils the same or can some oils be more slippery to improve ride compliance?

2013 White 650 Versys...Purrs like a kitty cat...
2007 Yamaha WR250F...Dirt Ripper...
mminob is offline  
post #57 of 84 (permalink) Old 06-16-2011, 10:50 PM
Member
 
Sprocket's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2010
Posts: 770
Just wondering about the dirty oil remark in the OP's initial post. How can you get dirty fork oil at only 1000miles and then again at 4000 miles? Were does the dirt come from in fork oil unless the seals are damaged?
Sprocket is offline  
post #58 of 84 (permalink) Old 06-17-2011, 12:16 AM
Member
 
mminob's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2008
Location: San Diego,California
Posts: 171
Dirty Fork Oil...

My factory oil smelled like auto transmission fluid...and was full of metallic specks...like glitter...like mud. Changed at 10,000 miles... it's really a good idea to flush out the particles ,they say. I'm afraid my fork bushings need to be replaced from too many wheelies and hard landings...

2013 White 650 Versys...Purrs like a kitty cat...
2007 Yamaha WR250F...Dirt Ripper...
mminob is offline  
post #59 of 84 (permalink) Old 06-17-2011, 05:52 AM
Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Texas
Posts: 137
Quote:
Originally Posted by ScottyNeal View Post
Phoneman, Tomla
... After reading all this, I'd like to replace the stock fork springs with Hyperpro progressive fork-springs, which also lower the bike a bit more.

I was thinking I'd first try the new springs, then change the shims as tried by one of you. Does anyone have recent experience to suggest for the revalving? I'm about 200# with all my gear.
You could be making a large change when you replace the springs. Not only the rate change but the oil that you use when you replace the springs. The stock springs on my '08 measured .80kg/mm. Knowing the precise rate of the replacement springs would be important for guessing which way to go on valving. However I think you will find that when you change the oil you will also be introducing a noticeable difference in how the valving performs.
Phoneman064 is offline  
post #60 of 84 (permalink) Old 06-17-2011, 06:08 AM
Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Texas
Posts: 137
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sprocket View Post
Just wondering about the dirty oil remark in the OP's initial post. How can you get dirty fork oil at only 1000miles and then again at 4000 miles? Were does the dirt come from in fork oil unless the seals are damaged?
As the fork flexes on compression it travels along an arc. The seal's job is to expand and contract as the fork leg travels up and down this curve. The elasticity of the rubber varies by manufacturer. A "grippy" seal causes stiction. A less elastic seal slides easier but may let in debris, air, water.

A worn seal lets in debris, air, and water.

Worn fork bushings allow the arc (curve) of the fork travel to exceed the seal's ability to stay in contact with the chrome part of the leg. This can allow debris, air and water to enter the fork even with new seals.

The environment in which you ride also greatly affects what ends up inside your fork legs. Riding a surface that generates alot of fork movement increases the opportunity for things to enter the fork. Riding dusty gravel roads is probably the worst case scenario.

The seal is not absolute, so even under perfect conditions it will allow some amount of contamination inside the fork leg.

On higher mileage oil changes the oil actually breaks down at the molecule level. The force of pushing the oil through the tiny passages wears it out.
Phoneman064 is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
Reply

Quick Reply
Message:
Options

Register Now



In order to be able to post messages on the Kawasaki Versys Forum forums, you must first register.
Please enter your desired user name, your email address and other required details in the form below.

User Name:
Password
Please enter a password for your user account. Note that passwords are case-sensitive.

Password:


Confirm Password:
Email Address
Please enter a valid email address for yourself.

Email Address:
OR

Log-in









Human Verification

In order to verify that you are a human and not a spam bot, please enter the answer into the following box below based on the instructions contained in the graphic.



Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Show Printable Version
Email this Page Email this Page
Display Modes
Linear Mode Linear Mode



Posting Rules  
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On

 
For the best viewing experience please update your browser to Google Chrome